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Capture HD video directly from HDMI uncompressed

 
 
Frank
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      02-22-2007
On Thu, 22 Feb 2007 16:04:12 -0500, in 'rec.video.production',
in article <Re: Capture HD video directly from HDMI uncompressed>,
"Smarty" <(E-Mail Removed)> wrote:

>Gene,
>
>HDV does a pretty good job of it on a minDV tape, and 80 minute tapes for
>HDV are on the market now.


Some of use wouldn't dream of using 80-minute tapes for anything.

>Not sure if you can pump HDMI video into an HDV
>camcorder and have it record in HDV.


No, you can't. As with the analog component video jacks on HDV and
AVCHD camcorders, the HDMI jacks on these products are also output
only. They do *not* accept an input signal, sorry.

>If so, then capturing HD via the HDMI
>port using the Blackmagic and then copying it to a miniDV with a camcorder
>would be a sweet little archiving solution at relatively low cost. Nice to
>see the Blackmagic has both HDMI IN and HDMI OUT ports.


--
Frank, Independent Consultant, New York, NY
[Please remove 'nojunkmail.' from address to reply via e-mail.]
Read Frank's thoughts on HDV at http://www.humanvalues.net/hdv/
 
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Jan Panteltje
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      02-22-2007
On a sunny day (Thu, 22 Feb 2007 20:14:30 GMT) it happened Jan Panteltje
<(E-Mail Removed)> wrote in <erktje$h07$(E-Mail Removed)>:

>Now let's extrapolate a bit:
>In the 1980 ties we were at 10MB for a harddisk.
>Now, say 20 years later, we are at 500 MB.


Oops, bit of an error, should be 500 GB
So, 50000 x increase in 20 years....
Extrapolating this means the 10 TB drive must already be on sale this week,
OK lemme google for it:
http://www.engadget.com/2006/09/17/s...rding-density/
http://forums.appleinsider.com/showthread.php?t=70012

hehe
 
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Jan Panteltje
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      02-22-2007
On a sunny day (Thu, 22 Feb 2007 16:01:14 -0500) it happened Frank
<(E-Mail Removed)> wrote in
<(E-Mail Removed)>:
>
>>Hi, thank you for the interesting posting.
>>For 1920x1080 @ 25fps I was thinking about the transfer rate for the disk
>>system that is required.
>>Let's see:
>>1920 x 1080 x 25 x 24 (bit per pixel) / 8 = 155 520 000 bytes / second,
>>is about 155 MB /s (1 244 160 000 bps, or 1.24 Gbits / s)

>
>Someone please correct me if I'm wrong (or if after 24 hours straight
>I really do need some sleep), but I believe that it's 4:2:2 not 4:4:4,
>so it's not 24 bits per pixel.


That may be, but if it is 10 bits luminance, and 10 for each chrominance,
then if YUYV it makes little difference.
It is late here too
Maybe somebody else knows?


 
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Smarty
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      02-22-2007
True Frank. You are more perceptive even after being without sleep for 24
hours than the rest of us are with normal sleep. The Intensity card does use
subsampled chroma components, 4:2:2. The storage estimate is therefore
somewhat pessimistic.

Smarty


"Frank" <(E-Mail Removed)> wrote in message
news:(E-Mail Removed)...
> On Thu, 22 Feb 2007 13:12:00 GMT, in 'rec.video.production',
> in article <Re: Capture HD video directly from HDMI uncompressed>,
> Jan Panteltje <(E-Mail Removed)> wrote:
>
>>On a sunny day (Wed, 21 Feb 2007 10:02:45 -0500) it happened "Smarty"
>><(E-Mail Removed)> wrote in
>><(E-Mail Removed) >:
>>
>>>Blackmagic has introduced a very novel capture card called Intensity for
>>>$249 which has an HDMI input and an HDMI output connector. It makes the
>>>impressive claim of eliminating HDV compression penalties by directly
>>>capturing uncompressed 1920 X 1080 HD video directly from HDV camcorders
>>>(at
>>>least those which have an HDMI output port) as well as from other HD and
>>>SD
>>>video sources. It offers a number of other impressive features as well,
>>>in
>>>particular real-time down-conversion from HD into SD and the ability to
>>>sync
>>>and switch 2 HDV camcorders with 2 cards in a studio setting. It provides
>>>HDMI output to drive monitors, projectors, etc. Macs and PCs are
>>>supported,
>>>but do require one newer PCI Express slot. It would appear to allow
>>>off-the-air HD capture external to set-top boxes equipped with HDMI (and
>>>DVI) outputs.
>>>
>>>Since copyright materials could be captured and digitized, the
>>>advertising
>>>plainly excludes protected content, and says the board will not be useful
>>>for those purposes.
>>>
>>>More info at: http://www.blackmagic-design.com/products/intensity/

>>
>>Hi, thank you for the interesting posting.
>>For 1920x1080 @ 25fps I was thinking about the transfer rate for the disk
>>system that is required.
>>Let's see:
>>1920 x 1080 x 25 x 24 (bit per pixel) / 8 = 155 520 000 bytes / second,
>>is about 155 MB /s (1 244 160 000 bps, or 1.24 Gbits / s)

>
> Someone please correct me if I'm wrong (or if after 24 hours straight
> I really do need some sleep), but I believe that it's 4:2:2 not 4:4:4,
> so it's not 24 bits per pixel.
>
>>It seems the disk system will have to be able to do about 200 MB/s
>>sustained.
>>
>>Not every harddisk will sustain this, I just looked around at the seagate
>>site for a usable disk...
>>It is not an interface issue (SATA or SCSI), SATA goes to 3Gb/s, but more
>>a drive issue.
>>Any comments?

>
> As above.
>
> --
> Frank, Independent Consultant, New York, NY
> [Please remove 'nojunkmail.' from address to reply via e-mail.]
> Read Frank's thoughts on HDV at http://www.humanvalues.net/hdv/



 
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Jan Panteltje
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      02-22-2007
On a sunny day (Thu, 22 Feb 2007 15:58:43 -0500) it happened "Smarty"
<(E-Mail Removed)> wrote in <(E-Mail Removed)>:

>Jan,
>
>This HDMI adapter does offer a "back-door" type of access to the cable and
>satellite content which could otherwise be difficult or impossible to gain
>access to / extract in mpeg2/mpeg4/H.264 .ps or .ts streams given the way
>the content cartel works and cable/satellite hardware is designed.


Well, I have some experience with that (cartel):
http://panteltje.com/panteltje/dvd/index.html
Unfortunately it is now very illegal to even (think?) about all that
The good news is Blu-Ray and that other HD DVD format is already in the clear .
I think most European DTV channels are in the clear too...
OTOH a news system with even more DRM is in the make for sat TV in Europe.
Personally I do not watch cracked stuff anymore, we have hundreds of free channels,
if they do not want me to see their advertisers, then that is their problem



>Recompression from the HDMI capture down to a BluRay or HD DVD compliant
>format would be inefficient and risk artifacts and image quality loss, but
>may be the only way to capture and then economically archive this type of
>programming. Alternately, perhaps the cable and satellite providers will
>offer burners in their HD PVRs. Time will tell.


Indeed.


>Since a 1 TB drive has already been announced, holding ~90 minutes of this
>raw content, I would think the time is almost immediate when a very usable
>somewhat modestly priced NLE could be built. Blackmagic identifies Adobe
>Premiere Pro, Final Cut, and other software as already being up to the task.
>Looks like a new and interesting next frontier.
>
>Smarty


Agreed.
 
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Gene
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      02-22-2007
LOL - someday my great, great, grandkids will have my entire
lifetime of A/V on one cheap little disc thing. Not sure if they
will ever watch 5 to 10K plus hours of video, but they will have it.
Wish I had a video of my grerat, great, Gramma & her
siblings at play.

Gene




"Jan Panteltje" <(E-Mail Removed)> wrote in message
news:erl1ko$q8p$(E-Mail Removed)...
> On a sunny day (Thu, 22 Feb 2007 20:14:30 GMT) it happened Jan Panteltje
> <(E-Mail Removed)> wrote in <erktje$h07$(E-Mail Removed)>:
>
>>Now let's extrapolate a bit:
>>In the 1980 ties we were at 10MB for a harddisk.
>>Now, say 20 years later, we are at 500 MB.

>
> Oops, bit of an error, should be 500 GB
> So, 50000 x increase in 20 years....
> Extrapolating this means the 10 TB drive must already be on sale this
> week,
> OK lemme google for it:
> http://www.engadget.com/2006/09/17/s...rding-density/
> http://forums.appleinsider.com/showthread.php?t=70012
>
> hehe



 
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Gene E. Bloch
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Posts: n/a
 
      02-23-2007
Hey, Smarty, any normal person who reads this newsgroup knows that
you're a regular here who often posts helpful stuff. I wouldn't think
anyone else thinks you're a spammer.

Read other posts by MP or his sockpuppets and you'll know all you need
to know about that.

On 2/21/2007, Smarty posted this:
> One of my students brought this new HDMI capture card to me today, and both
> of us were trying it out on the MacPro here. It's only been on the market for
> a few weeks (press release announcing it in mid January) and it is the very
> first and only card which does HDMI capture. (I don't ever recall seeing a
> card which does DVI capture either for that matter.)
>
> This post has nothing to do with shills, lame salesmanship, or "pushing a
> product" as you call it. I couldn't care less whether this company or product
> succeeds or fails commercially.
>
> My motive was simply to inform others who may not have been aware of the
> product.
>
> Sorry if it offended you.
>
> Smarty
>
>
>
> "MassiveProng" <(E-Mail Removed)> wrote in
> message news:(E-Mail Removed)...
>> On Wed, 21 Feb 2007 19:51:16 -0600, "Ken Maltby"
>> <(E-Mail Removed)> Gave us:
>>
>>> Blackmagic has a good rep. in the budget broadcasting
>>>field.

>>
>>
>> Not if they have retarded shills SPAMMING Usenet groups due to lame
>> salesmanship.
>>
>> And yes, it was SPAM.
>>
>> This group is about DVDs not some lame asswipe pushing a product for
>> sale.


--
Gene E. Bloch (Gino)
letters617blochg3251
(replace the numbers by "at" and "dotcom")


 
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Gene E. Bloch
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Posts: n/a
 
      02-23-2007
On 2/22/2007, nappy posted this:
> "Larry in AZ" <(E-Mail Removed)> wrote in message
> news:Xns98DF871C61908thefrogprince@69.28.173.184.. .
>> Waiving the right to remain silent, "nappy" <(E-Mail Removed)> said:
>>
>>> "MassiveProng" <(E-Mail Removed)> wrote in
>>> message news:(E-Mail Removed)...
>>>> On Wed, 21 Feb 2007 22:25:28 -0500, "Smarty" <(E-Mail Removed)> Gave
>>>> us:
>>>>
>>>>>This post has nothing to do with shills, lame salesmanship, or "pushing
>>>>>a product" as you call it. I couldn't care less whether this company or
>>>>>product succeeds or fails commercially.
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> Or, apparently, whether or not this Chinese import POS is even legal.
>>>>
>>>> Cross posting to so many groups is also frowned upon by ISPs these
>>>> days, so if you were not spamming, dipshit, you should at least learn
>>>> to follow PROPER Usenet posting conventions.
>>>
>>> Oh.. where did this twit come from. Never heard of Blackmagic? SPAM?
>>>
>>> Damn.. I come back and the place is chock full of dolts. Don't look now
>>> but that Massive Prong is protruding from your forehead.

>>
>> The dipstick posts from alt.video.dvd.
>>
>> What does a stupid nym like "MassiveProng" tell you..?

>
> .1 inch?


OK, I give up: length or diameter?

--
Gene E. Bloch (Gino)
letters617blochg3251
(replace the numbers by "at" and "dotcom")


 
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Gene E. Bloch
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Posts: n/a
 
      02-23-2007
On 2/22/2007, Jan Panteltje posted this:
> On a sunny day (Thu, 22 Feb 2007 20:14:30 GMT) it happened Jan Panteltje
> <(E-Mail Removed)> wrote in <erktje$h07$(E-Mail Removed)>:
>
>> Now let's extrapolate a bit:
>> In the 1980 ties we were at 10MB for a harddisk.
>> Now, say 20 years later, we are at 500 MB.

>
> Oops, bit of an error, should be 500 GB
> So, 50000 x increase in 20 years....
> Extrapolating this means the 10 TB drive must already be on sale this week,
> OK lemme google for it:
>
> http://www.engadget.com/2006/09/17/s...rding-density/
> http://forums.appleinsider.com/showthread.php?t=70012
>
> hehe


My favorite part of this (besides the amazement!) was their comment
about "more space than anyone could possibly need, ever" - plus their
reason for it...

And Gene's reply to you reminds me of a discussion I had around 1980
with a folk-dance teacher, also a techie. I said that someday our
entire folk-dance music repertoire would fit into a 1" cube. He said
"No way!". Today my iPod holds more music than his entire folk-dance
record collection, but he was right - it's not a 1" cube

--
Gene E. Bloch (Gino)
letters617blochg3251
(replace the numbers by "at" and "dotcom")


 
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Stuart
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Posts: n/a
 
      02-23-2007

"Smarty" <(E-Mail Removed)> wrote in message
news:(E-Mail Removed)...
> One of my students brought this new HDMI capture card to me today, and
> both of us were trying it out on the MacPro here. It's only been on the
> market for a few weeks (press release announcing it in mid January) and it
> is the very first and only card which does HDMI capture. (I don't ever
> recall seeing a card which does DVI capture either for that matter.)
>
> This post has nothing to do with shills, lame salesmanship, or "pushing a
> product" as you call it. I couldn't care less whether this company or
> product succeeds or fails commercially.
>
> My motive was simply to inform others who may not have been aware of the
> product.
>
> Sorry if it offended you.
>
> Smarty
>
>
>
> "MassiveProng" <(E-Mail Removed)> wrote in
> message news:(E-Mail Removed)...
>> On Wed, 21 Feb 2007 19:51:16 -0600, "Ken Maltby"
>> <(E-Mail Removed)> Gave us:
>>
>>> Blackmagic has a good rep. in the budget broadcasting
>>>field.

>>
>>
>> Not if they have retarded shills SPAMMING Usenet groups due to lame
>> salesmanship.
>>
>> And yes, it was SPAM.
>>
>> This group is about DVDs not some lame asswipe pushing a product for
>> sale.

>
>


regrettably there are many people who simply enjoy being offended - they
allow themselves to be offended. I've long learnt to simply ignore these
people. As children they were the ones in supermarkets having a hissy fit
etc. I found the original post informative and have in-fact placed an order.
Maybe the cross posting to different groups is not a good idea but the
device itself is a useful device in the preparation and capture of material
for a DVD...... so it's not that far off. People who react emotionally with
caps etc and poorly chosen descriptive adjectives should be encouraged to go
back to school or if located in the USA maybe the latest fad of Rehab!


 
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