Velocity Reviews - Computer Hardware Reviews

Velocity Reviews > Newsgroups > Programming > Python > My future Python IDE article

Reply
Thread Tools

My future Python IDE article

 
 
Lothar Scholz
Guest
Posts: n/a
 
      08-27-2003
"Ulrich Petri" <(E-Mail Removed)> wrote in message news:<biipks$9mguu$(E-Mail Removed)-berlin.de>...
> "David Mertz" <(E-Mail Removed)> schrieb im Newsbeitrag
> news:(E-Mail Removed)...
> > Pythonistas,
> >
> > So c.l.py readers... make the case for your favorite one getting on the
> > list. I have a while to ponder the opinions advanced, should this
> > prompt some discussion (it may take a little while to order review
> > copies of commercial tools and/or get things installed).
> >

>
> You should definitely consider Boa-Constructor (be sure to use at least v.
> 0.23, better yet the recent cvs version).
> IMHO its the most "complete" python IDE at the moment.


But not easy to use and with a lot of bugs. Maybe some less features
and more stability would be nice.

And it is not complete if you want to program Web Applications.
 
Reply With Quote
 
 
 
 
Mike Thompson
Guest
Posts: n/a
 
      08-27-2003
"Gerhard Häring" <(E-Mail Removed)> wrote in message
news:(E-Mail Removed)...
> Mike Thompson wrote:
> > "David Mertz" wrote:
> >>So c.l.py readers... make the case for your favorite one getting on the
> >>list.

> >
> > I'm surprised no one has mentioned Boa. I tryed Wing & Komodo, before

finding
> > Boa.

>
> Boa is far from finished. Depending on your wxPython version and how you
> use the IDE, it could work surprisingly well or annoy you to no end in
> my experience.
>
> I'd recommend to not review alpha software like Boa.
>



That's not my experience. I've found Boa both stable, functional and well
priced.

I tried Wing and generally liked it, except that I'm used to an editor with
tabs for each open file and I found Wing's "one file at a time arrangement"
didn't match my way of working.

I tried Komodo, which has an enormous feature set that goes well beyond python,
which I liked until I came to run my first wxPython based program under the
debugger and it froze. I never did get to the bottom of why.

In between all this I attempted to use Eric but had difficulty getting it
setup. From memory, after some googling around, I found a few similar reports
and abandoned the effort.

I then tried Boa and haven't moved since.

My search has occurred over the last six months. About twelve months ago I also
tried the Secret Labs IDE (can't remember the name) which I found a bit of work
initially, but ended up quite liking. However this product now seems to have
been withdrawn from the market.

If you have to restrict it to 3, my suggestion would be:
Wing
Boa
IDLE

That would give you a mix of commerical and free. All are cross-platform.

If not IDLE, then Komodo which has a very inexpensive licence for personal
use..

--
Mike




 
Reply With Quote
 
 
 
 
smarter_than_you
Guest
Posts: n/a
 
      08-28-2003
Another shout-out for Pythoncard. It's at an early stage but I
_really_ like the design philosophy. The code editor is nice (Boa
might have a slight advantage here, but it's definitely usable). The
GUI constructor is the best I've seen, and I've been shopping for a
useful builder for a while.

Best of all, unlike Boa, the code it generates is clean and well laid
out, with a .rsrc.py file that is just a little list of dicts with
parameters for all your widgets.

YMMV


http://www.velocityreviews.com/forums/(E-Mail Removed) (R.Marquez) wrote in message news:<(E-Mail Removed). com>...
> > So c.l.py readers... make the case for your favorite one getting on the
> > list. I have a while to ponder the opinions advanced, should this
> > prompt some discussion (it may take a little while to order review
> > copies of commercial tools and/or get things installed).

>
> I work on Windows mostly, and Pythonwin has been great for a few
> years, although it doesn't have any GUI building facilities. Lately,
> due to a bug in the last release (which I have already submitted), I
> have taken the opportunity to give others a try. I am not currently
> interested in paying for an IDE.
>
> I tried BOA a little while ago. My first impression was "wow, someone
> has done a lot of work here". However, I didn't like the fact that I
> had to mold my code to the way the application wants it. For example,
> I have to always have a "main" function. Maybe that is a good
> practice, but being forced to it didn't give me a good feeling. The
> code it generated for the GUI was a bit verbose and it... I don't
> know. It just didn't seem to simplify things for me too much. I
> probably should go back and give it another try one of these days.
>
> Idle is nice enough, although like Pythonwin, it doesn't have any GUI
> building facilities. Surprisingly for me, I couldn't find some basic
> features for simple code editing that I really like. For example, I
> couldn't find a way to have white space visible. It also doesn't seem
> to have an indentation guide feature, which I find very useful in
> Pythonwin (this feature seems to me to be a must for a Python code
> editor since indentation is so crucial in it). Also, I could not see
> how to display line numbers (although it does have a "Go to line"
> feature).
>
> I was surprised to find all of these features as well as most other
> features that I expected for basic code editing on the PythonCard
> prototype Code Editor. And, PythonCard is an actual Application
> builder, with outstanding GUI building facilities and all. I think
> that PythonCard has the potential to be the best IDE/App Builder for
> Python. It uses wxPython as its foundation, which I think is most GUI
> developers favorite *free* toolkit. Unfortunately, a lot of the
> wxPython widgets have yet to be integrated. However, it is already
> usable for simple GUI applications. So, if you haven't given a try I
> would encourage you to do so. You may just see what I mean.
>
> I still like Pythonwin as my favorite Code Editor in Windows. But,
> until my little bug is fixed I think I am sticking with PythonCard's
> Code Editor.
>
> -Ruben

 
Reply With Quote
 
Gerrit van Dyk
Guest
Posts: n/a
 
      08-28-2003
Just my 2 cents worth:

Xemacs/Emacs with python-mode bindings + pychecker and some screen editor
for gui apps (wxDesigner/Boa for wxPython,BlackAdder/Qt Designer for Qt
etc)

Regards
Gerrit




 
Reply With Quote
 
Kevin Altis
Guest
Posts: n/a
 
      08-28-2003

"David Mertz" <(E-Mail Removed)> wrote in message
news:(E-Mail Removed)...
> Pythonistas,
>
> My loyal fans will remember that I did a Python IDE roundup for
> _Charming Python_ a couple years back. Now I have another such roundup
> lined up... not the very next article, but it's there on the list.
>
> In the intervening years, I've hardly touched anything one might call an
> IDE. I've looked at screenshots from time to time, and read various
> announcements. But really I just use text editors and command lines.
>
> Here's the thing: I probably have room to look at about four different
> tools in one article. In fact, it wouldn't be absurd to only do three.
> Past that, I cannot do more than list contact information and platform
> in the available words. I'm sure there are more than four IDEs that
> -someone- loves to work with out there... but I need to have a cutoff.
>
> So c.l.py readers... make the case for your favorite one getting on the
> list. I have a while to ponder the opinions advanced, should this
> prompt some discussion (it may take a little while to order review
> copies of commercial tools and/or get things installed).
>
> Yours, David...


So, I guess the key question is what features are required to be considered
an IDE? If you're simply talking about an editor with an integrated debugger
then there is a lot to choose from and certainly IDLE (formerly IDLEfork
should be included) just for completeness. Based on the responses to c.l.py
a lot of people seem to think vim and Emacs qualify as IDEs, but those would
probably be best covered in their own articles. Just out of curiosity, I
checked the "definition" of an IDE.


http://dictionary.reference.com/sear...ment%20environ
ment

One thing I've found quite interesting about Python is that when I started
using it I was disappointed in the debugger support, since I was used to
more elaborate systems from my compiled language days. There is also the pro
blem that many Python editors/IDEs including the old IDLE couldn't debug GUI
code if the IDE used a different toolkit than your app (tkinter, win32,
wxPython, Qt, etc.) Then I realized that at least for the kind of GUI work I
do the debugger fell into the YAGNI category and I end up doing most of my
exploration in the shell at runtime or using print or log statements for
other bits. It will be interesting to see whether the ability to set
breakpoints and do other debugger sorts of things becomes more important to
me in the future.

Some people seem to think an IDE means integrated layout capabilities. That
would narrow the field considerably. Boa should be considered in your
selections regardless of whether its wxPython GUI capabilities are needed.

PythonCard, at least in its current form doesn't really qualify as an IDE
since the codeEditor is just a source editor, it doesn't have a debugger and
it is not integrated with the resourceEditor which handles layouts. A future
version will have a more integrated environment.

ka

 
Reply With Quote
 
Alan James Salmoni
Guest
Posts: n/a
 
      08-28-2003
Gerhard,

Do'h! Sincerest apologies. I'll report to the torture chamber for
immediate privation. I won't be allowed to use Python for a whole
week...

Alan.

Gerhard Häring <(E-Mail Removed)> wrote in message news:<(E-Mail Removed)>...
> Alan James Salmoni wrote:
> > Personally, I would include:
> >
> > 1) SciTE [...]
> > 2) Leo [...]

>
> Neither one is an IDE (they lack a debugger). They're only editors.
>
> -- Gerhard

 
Reply With Quote
 
Larry
Guest
Posts: n/a
 
      08-28-2003
David Mertz wrote:

> Pythonistas,
>
> My loyal fans will remember that I did a Python IDE roundup for
> _Charming Python_ a couple years back. Now I have another such roundup
> lined up... not the very next article, but it's there on the list.
>
> In the intervening years, I've hardly touched anything one might call an
> IDE. I've looked at screenshots from time to time, and read various
> announcements. But really I just use text editors and command lines.
>
> Here's the thing: I probably have room to look at about four different
> tools in one article. In fact, it wouldn't be absurd to only do three.
> Past that, I cannot do more than list contact information and platform
> in the available words. I'm sure there are more than four IDEs that
> -someone- loves to work with out there... but I need to have a cutoff.
>
> So c.l.py readers... make the case for your favorite one getting on the
> list. I have a while to ponder the opinions advanced, should this
> prompt some discussion (it may take a little while to order review
> copies of commercial tools and/or get things installed).
>
> Yours, David...



There is a brand new version of BlackAdder available from theKompany.com
that is quite impressive.

http://www.thekompany.com/products/blackadder/

Screenshots here....
http://www.thekompany.com/products/b...reenshots.php3

 
Reply With Quote
 
Hardy Jonck
Guest
Posts: n/a
 
      09-09-2003
(E-Mail Removed) (David Mertz) wrote in message news:<(E-Mail Removed)>...
> Pythonistas,
>
>
> So c.l.py readers... make the case for your favorite one getting on the
> list. I have a while to ponder the opinions advanced, should this
> prompt some discussion (it may take a little while to order review
> copies of commercial tools and/or get things installed).
>
> Yours, David...


I recently had a look at Jedit and must say I am impressed. Python
support via Jython 2.1 - but the extensibility and philosophy that
comes with Jedit is amazing. Would be nice to have more development in
it to make it an even better Python editor that it is now. It has
advanced features, very good code folding, excellent searching, class
browser, integration with Ctags that works great with Python, regular
expression cross project search and replace, sftp, ftp, CVS
integration (GREAT) and integrated DIFF, XML and XPATH, and tons of
other very handy plugins to do 100% hands off mouseless efficient
editing.

Have a look at www.jedit.org and install version 4.1 stable. Install
Jython from the plugins directory and make shure to set the prefrences
so that it pre-loads Jython and classes. Then install Sidekick and
tags. Set Folding mode to Sodekick and that almost completes the
setup. Now install gruntspud from the plugins directory and you have
CVS with full integration into the editor.

Only thing missing is full code completion like PythonWIn offers...

Sincerely,
Hardy Jonck
 
Reply With Quote
 
Etienne Labuschagne
Guest
Posts: n/a
 
      09-09-2003
1st, 2nd and 3rd Boa Constructor

I find this quite stable on Windows (latest version 0.2.3) and I find
the following it's best features:

o THE BEST Zope support for a free IDE - create Zope objects such as
Files, DTML Documents, Page Templates, etc. Debug Zope Python
Scripts, external methods, Zope itself, and to a limited extent, DTML
documents and Page Templates!
o Out of process debugger that can attach to remote Python processes
and debug Zope (THE best feature!), in multiple threads! Debugger can
be a bit tempremental, but it's very powerful (I have debugged
client's systems over the internet!)
o Multiple transports - edit files on the file system, through FTP,
Webdav, etc.
o Nice editor, with tabbed view of all open files, full Regular
expression search and replace functionality (over multiple files),
reindetation function, code and parameter completion, code highliting
and hyperlink-like "jump to declaration". Lots of other things not
mentioned here.
o wxPython GUI development (code generation, no XML)

There are some niggles, but personally I have found it quite stable
and VERY feature rich and probably the most feature rich environment
for Python and Zope. (I'm beginning to sound like a Zealot)

4th. PythonWin
A nice "side kick" to Boa for the very few things it does better than
Boa, has a nifty "Post mortem" debugger that breaks execution on an
exception (and rolls back to just before the exception).
 
Reply With Quote
 
Paul Reznicek
Guest
Posts: n/a
 
      09-09-2003
(E-Mail Removed) (Lothar Scholz) wrote in message news:<(E-Mail Removed). com>...

> .....
> And it is not complete if you want to program Web Applications.


What is the better one for program Web Applications?

Paul
 
Reply With Quote
 
 
 
Reply

Thread Tools

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Trackbacks are On
Pingbacks are On
Refbacks are Off


Similar Threads
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
Article on the future of Python Mark Lawrence Python 129 09-29-2012 03:07 AM
Re: Article on the future of Python Michael Harleman Python 0 09-25-2012 10:51 AM
Re: Calling a Perl Module from Python ( future direction of Python) gf gf Python 5 04-07-2005 02:09 PM
Python IDE like NetBeans/Delphi IDE fowlertrainer@anonym.hu Python 5 04-06-2005 05:56 AM
Toward Python's future article daniel narf Python 3 10-08-2004 05:18 AM



Advertisments