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Port forwarding with two routers

 
 
Chris Fonville
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      06-06-2004
I can't seem to get port forwarding to work with two routers. I have a
BroadMax LinkMAX ADSL modem which has port forwarding, but I also have a
Microsoft MN-500 wireless router with port forwarding. I have setup both to
forward ports to my local IP address but it isn't working. I have disabled
all the firewalls and still nothing. How can I make this work? Thank you,
Chris


 
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Duane Arnold
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      06-06-2004
"Chris Fonville" <(E-Mail Removed)> wrote in
news:c9tsk9$4tbh$(E-Mail Removed):

> I can't seem to get port forwarding to work with two routers. I have
> a BroadMax LinkMAX ADSL modem which has port forwarding, but I also
> have a Microsoft MN-500 wireless router with port forwarding. I have
> setup both to forward ports to my local IP address but it isn't
> working. I have disabled all the firewalls and still nothing. How
> can I make this work? Thank you, Chris
>
>
>


You should not be doing port forwarding of ports from one router to
another router. Where is the *trusted* or protected network segment in
that situation?

Just what is it that you're trying to accomplish with the two routers?

Duane
 
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Chris Fonville
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      06-06-2004

"Duane Arnold" <(E-Mail Removed)> wrote in message
news:Xns94FFE1A54C64Enotmenotmecoml@63.240.76.16.. .
> "Chris Fonville" <(E-Mail Removed)> wrote in
> news:c9tsk9$4tbh$(E-Mail Removed):
>
> > I can't seem to get port forwarding to work with two routers. I have
> > a BroadMax LinkMAX ADSL modem which has port forwarding, but I also
> > have a Microsoft MN-500 wireless router with port forwarding. I have
> > setup both to forward ports to my local IP address but it isn't
> > working. I have disabled all the firewalls and still nothing. How
> > can I make this work? Thank you, Chris
> >
> >
> >

>
> You should not be doing port forwarding of ports from one router to
> another router. Where is the *trusted* or protected network segment in
> that situation?
>
> Just what is it that you're trying to accomplish with the two routers?
>
> Duane


Well I just want to forward some ports to my computer but it doesn't seem to
be working since I have added the wireless router. The reason that I am
running two routers is because the first is my ADSL modem, it's not a true
router but it does have NAT and port forwarding. The other router I added
because I have another computer set-up that I wanted to give wireless
internet access to and that's why I added the second router. Any ideas?
Thanks,
Chris


 
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Duane Arnold
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      06-06-2004
"Chris Fonville" <(E-Mail Removed)> wrote in
news:c9u91k$523h$(E-Mail Removed):

>
> "Duane Arnold" <(E-Mail Removed)> wrote in message
> news:Xns94FFE1A54C64Enotmenotmecoml@63.240.76.16.. .
>> "Chris Fonville" <(E-Mail Removed)> wrote in
>> news:c9tsk9$4tbh$(E-Mail Removed):
>>
>> > I can't seem to get port forwarding to work with two routers. I
>> > have a BroadMax LinkMAX ADSL modem which has port forwarding, but I
>> > also have a Microsoft MN-500 wireless router with port forwarding.
>> > I have setup both to forward ports to my local IP address but it
>> > isn't working. I have disabled all the firewalls and still
>> > nothing. How can I make this work? Thank you, Chris
>> >
>> >
>> >

>>
>> You should not be doing port forwarding of ports from one router to
>> another router. Where is the *trusted* or protected network segment
>> in that situation?
>>
>> Just what is it that you're trying to accomplish with the two
>> routers?
>>
>> Duane

>
> Well I just want to forward some ports to my computer but it doesn't
> seem to be working since I have added the wireless router. The reason
> that I am running two routers is because the first is my ADSL modem,
> it's not a true router but it does have NAT and port forwarding.


Does the ADSL router modem DHCP server capabilities?

> The
> other router I added because I have another computer set-up that I
> wanted to give wireless internet access to and that's why I added the
> second router. Any ideas? Thanks,


If the ADSL router has DHCP server abilities, that's good and we may be
able to do something there.

What O/S is on the machines?

Duane
 
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Chris Fonville
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      06-06-2004

"Duane Arnold" <(E-Mail Removed)> wrote in message
news:Xns9500E5F35AE4notmenotmecoml@63.240.76.16...
> "Chris Fonville" <(E-Mail Removed)> wrote in
> news:c9u91k$523h$(E-Mail Removed):
>
> >
> > "Duane Arnold" <(E-Mail Removed)> wrote in message
> > news:Xns94FFE1A54C64Enotmenotmecoml@63.240.76.16.. .
> >> "Chris Fonville" <(E-Mail Removed)> wrote in
> >> news:c9tsk9$4tbh$(E-Mail Removed):
> >>
> >> > I can't seem to get port forwarding to work with two routers. I
> >> > have a BroadMax LinkMAX ADSL modem which has port forwarding, but I
> >> > also have a Microsoft MN-500 wireless router with port forwarding.
> >> > I have setup both to forward ports to my local IP address but it
> >> > isn't working. I have disabled all the firewalls and still
> >> > nothing. How can I make this work? Thank you, Chris
> >> >
> >> >
> >> >
> >>
> >> You should not be doing port forwarding of ports from one router to
> >> another router. Where is the *trusted* or protected network segment
> >> in that situation?
> >>
> >> Just what is it that you're trying to accomplish with the two
> >> routers?
> >>
> >> Duane

> >
> > Well I just want to forward some ports to my computer but it doesn't
> > seem to be working since I have added the wireless router. The reason
> > that I am running two routers is because the first is my ADSL modem,
> > it's not a true router but it does have NAT and port forwarding.

>
> Does the ADSL router modem DHCP server capabilities?


Yes, and it's enabled.

>
> > The
> > other router I added because I have another computer set-up that I
> > wanted to give wireless internet access to and that's why I added the
> > second router. Any ideas? Thanks,

>
> If the ADSL router has DHCP server abilities, that's good and we may be
> able to do something there.
>
> What O/S is on the machines?
>
> Duane


Windows XP Home and both machines, however I just want to port forward to
one machine. Thank you for helping me out,
Chris


 
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Duane Arnold
Guest
Posts: n/a
 
      06-06-2004
>> Does the ADSL router modem DHCP server capabilities?
>
> Yes, and it's enabled.
>
>>
>> > The
>> > other router I added because I have another computer set-up that I
>> > wanted to give wireless internet access to and that's why I added

the
>> > second router. Any ideas? Thanks,

>>
>> If the ADSL router has DHCP server abilities, that's good and we may

be
>> able to do something there.
>>
>> What O/S is on the machines?
>>
>> Duane

>
> Windows XP Home and both machines, however I just want to port forward

to
> one machine. Thank you for helping me out,
> Chris


Using the ADSL Router as the DHCP server for the entire network, you're
going to configure the wireless router to be a WAP/wired (switch).

1) Disable DHCP on the wireless router.

2) Set the LAN/Device to a static IP that's not a DHCP IP that the ADSL
router can issue. For an example, if the LAN/Device IP on the ADSL router
is 192.168.1.1 and the DHCP IP(s) started at 192.168.1.100, then you'll
going to set the LAN/Device IP for the wireless router to 192.168.1.2 a
static IP.

You're setting the wireless router's LAN/Device IP to one of the ADSL
router's static IP(s) so that any computer getting a DHCP from the ADSL
router or using a static IP on the ADSL router that's connected to the
WAP/wired (switch) can access the Admin screen on the wireless
router/switch at 192.168.1.2.

3) Using an RJ45 or CAT 5 cable, you'll connect LAN port to LAN port from
a LAN port on the ADSL router to a LAN port on the wireless router. You
will not be using the WAN port on the wireless router and making the LAN
port to LAN port connection between the two devices turns the wireless
router into a WAP/wired (switch).

4) If the wireless router ADmin screen has a setting to set the router to
*Router* or *Gateway* mode, you'll select *Router*. If the router doesn't
have the setting, then it's OK.

With the setup, all machines on the network will be using the ADSL router
as the DHCP server and wired or wireless computers can use the WAP/wired
switch. And a machine connected to the ADSL router will be able to
communicate to a machine connected to the WAP/wire switch.

You'll be able to port forward to any machine on the network from the
ADSL router, which BTW the machine should be using a static IP of the
ADSL router.

Of course, the wireless router and whatever FW capabilities are not there
anymore.

However, you can use IPsec, which I have implemented on my LAN. IPsec
works like a FW, and it can stop inbound or outbound traffic by port,
protocol, DNS, or IP if need be. It sits behind BlackIce.

The AnalogX SecPol file when implemented provides instant protection on
the LAN. IPsec is not that hard to use, once one reviews the base
policies AnalogX has implemented.

http://www.petri.co.il/block_ping_tr...with_ipsec.htm
http://www.analogx.com/contents/articles/ipsec.htm

You should rotate the SSID and WEP or WAP key on a routine basis. You
should limit the number of DHCP IP(s) to the number of machines you have
to protect on the wireless and someone obtaining a DHCP IP from your
network -- (that's not 100% as some can use a static IP). If you can
enable logging on the ADSL router review inbound and outbound traffic on
the router.

If the device cannot meet the specs in the link, then it doesn't have a
*true* FW.

http://www.firewall-software.com/fir...rewall_do.html

Lastly, the protection starts with the O/S secure the XP O/S from attack.

http://www.uksecurityonline.com/index5.php

HTH

Duane






 
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Chris Fonville
Guest
Posts: n/a
 
      06-06-2004
"Duane Arnold" <(E-Mail Removed)> wrote in message
news:Xns95008499A4B4Enotmenotmecoml@204.127.199.17 ...
> >> Does the ADSL router modem DHCP server capabilities?

> >
> > Yes, and it's enabled.
> >
> >>
> >> > The
> >> > other router I added because I have another computer set-up that I
> >> > wanted to give wireless internet access to and that's why I added

> the
> >> > second router. Any ideas? Thanks,
> >>
> >> If the ADSL router has DHCP server abilities, that's good and we may

> be
> >> able to do something there.
> >>
> >> What O/S is on the machines?
> >>
> >> Duane

> >
> > Windows XP Home and both machines, however I just want to port forward

> to
> > one machine. Thank you for helping me out,
> > Chris

>
> Using the ADSL Router as the DHCP server for the entire network, you're
> going to configure the wireless router to be a WAP/wired (switch).
>
> 1) Disable DHCP on the wireless router.


I can do that, but also there is a place in the routers setup that I can
switch from "Routing mode" to "Bridging mode" which says it turns it into a
basic switch or access point. Do I need to do that instead of just turning
off DHCP? Also in this "bridging mode" I cannot access the router's config
to change the IP address, etc. Would I need to? Or would simply changing
it to that mode and plugging the cable from my modem into a LAN jack work?

>
> 2) Set the LAN/Device to a static IP that's not a DHCP IP that the ADSL
> router can issue. For an example, if the LAN/Device IP on the ADSL router
> is 192.168.1.1 and the DHCP IP(s) started at 192.168.1.100, then you'll
> going to set the LAN/Device IP for the wireless router to 192.168.1.2 a
> static IP.


Right now my ADSL modem's IP is set at 198.162.0.1, and the IP of the
wireless router is 198.162.2.1. That's where I can access the setup of both
of them. In my ADSL modem's setup the range of IP's is 198.162.0.2 through
198.162.0.200. What would I need to set the IP of my wireless router to be
if that is the case?

>
> You're setting the wireless router's LAN/Device IP to one of the ADSL
> router's static IP(s) so that any computer getting a DHCP from the ADSL
> router or using a static IP on the ADSL router that's connected to the
> WAP/wired (switch) can access the Admin screen on the wireless
> router/switch at 192.168.1.2.
>
> 3) Using an RJ45 or CAT 5 cable, you'll connect LAN port to LAN port from
> a LAN port on the ADSL router to a LAN port on the wireless router. You
> will not be using the WAN port on the wireless router and making the LAN
> port to LAN port connection between the two devices turns the wireless
> router into a WAP/wired (switch).
>
> 4) If the wireless router ADmin screen has a setting to set the router to
> *Router* or *Gateway* mode, you'll select *Router*. If the router doesn't
> have the setting, then it's OK.
>
> With the setup, all machines on the network will be using the ADSL router
> as the DHCP server and wired or wireless computers can use the WAP/wired
> switch. And a machine connected to the ADSL router will be able to
> communicate to a machine connected to the WAP/wire switch.
>
> You'll be able to port forward to any machine on the network from the
> ADSL router, which BTW the machine should be using a static IP of the
> ADSL router.
>
> Of course, the wireless router and whatever FW capabilities are not there
> anymore.
>
> However, you can use IPsec, which I have implemented on my LAN. IPsec
> works like a FW, and it can stop inbound or outbound traffic by port,
> protocol, DNS, or IP if need be. It sits behind BlackIce.
>
> The AnalogX SecPol file when implemented provides instant protection on
> the LAN. IPsec is not that hard to use, once one reviews the base
> policies AnalogX has implemented.
>
> http://www.petri.co.il/block_ping_tr...with_ipsec.htm
> http://www.analogx.com/contents/articles/ipsec.htm
>
> You should rotate the SSID and WEP or WAP key on a routine basis. You
> should limit the number of DHCP IP(s) to the number of machines you have
> to protect on the wireless and someone obtaining a DHCP IP from your
> network -- (that's not 100% as some can use a static IP). If you can
> enable logging on the ADSL router review inbound and outbound traffic on
> the router.
>
> If the device cannot meet the specs in the link, then it doesn't have a
> *true* FW.
>
> http://www.firewall-software.com/fir...rewall_do.html
>
> Lastly, the protection starts with the O/S secure the XP O/S from attack.
>
> http://www.uksecurityonline.com/index5.php
>
> HTH
>
> Duane
>


Thank you for your help, I'm going to go try this out, but if you could
reply with those other details above it would be very helpful. Thank you
again for your help,
Chris


 
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Duane Arnold
Guest
Posts: n/a
 
      06-06-2004
>> Using the ADSL Router as the DHCP server for the entire network,
>> you're going to configure the wireless router to be a WAP/wired
>> (switch).
>>
>> 1) Disable DHCP on the wireless router.

>
> I can do that, but also there is a place in the routers setup that I
> can switch from "Routing mode" to "Bridging mode" which says it turns
> it into a basic switch or access point. Do I need to do that instead
> of just turning off DHCP?


The one thing I think you don't want to do is have the wireless router
issue its own DHCP IP(s) on the network. The ADSL router should be the
only DHCP server on the network. So, if configuring the wireless router
in Bridge Mode accomplishes DHCP being disabled, then fine, and if not,
then you need to have DHCP disabled I would think.

You should get on the phone and talk with Tech Support as I did with my
Linksys wireless router and find out the particulars about the different
modes of the router and your intended usage.


> Also in this "bridging mode" I cannot
> access the router's config to change the IP address, etc. Would I
> need to? Or would simply changing it to that mode and plugging the
> cable from my modem into a LAN jack work?


Tech Support can help you with the particulars about the router.

>
>>
>> 2) Set the LAN/Device to a static IP that's not a DHCP IP that the
>> ADSL router can issue. For an example, if the LAN/Device IP on the
>> ADSL router is 192.168.1.1 and the DHCP IP(s) started at
>> 192.168.1.100, then you'll going to set the LAN/Device IP for the
>> wireless router to 192.168.1.2 a static IP.

>
> Right now my ADSL modem's IP is set at 198.162.0.1, and the IP of the
> wireless router is 198.162.2.1. That's where I can access the setup
> of both of them. In my ADSL modem's setup the range of IP's is
> 198.162.0.2 through 198.162.0.200. What would I need to set the IP of
> my wireless router to be if that is the case?


You can set it to any IP on the ADSL router that is not going to create a
multiple usage conflict situation, like you using an IP that's in the
198.162.0.2-198.162.0.200. And besides, you got 198 DHCP IP(s) that can
be issued and you don't have 198 machines. You need to limit the number
of DHCP IP(s) that can be issued, because of the WAP setup and *War
Driving*.

You have the blue print, implement it.

Good luck with your mission.

Duane
 
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