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Security feature in Microsoft's new Windows (Vista) could drive users nuts

 
 
Imhotep
Guest
Posts: n/a
 
      05-16-2006
"SEATTLE - An annoying surprise awaits 2 million consumers expected to
enthusiastically step forward in the next few weeks to help Microsoft test
its new Windows Vista PC operating system.

Volunteers will test Vista Beta 2, a near-final version of the much-hyped
upgrade of Windows. The testing is the last step leading up to Vista's
broad consumer release, scheduled for January.

Beta 2 testers can expect to encounter an obtrusive security feature, called
User Account Control (UAC). Designed to prevent intruders from performing
harmful tasks, the feature grays out the computer screen, then prods you to
confirm that you really want to do certain functions.

In early test versions, the queries crop up so often that they interrupt
routine tasks, such as changing the time clock or deleting shortcuts. And
UAC sometimes triggers an endless loop of dialogue boxes that can be
curtailed only by rebooting, says Paul Thurrott, news editor of Windows IT
Pro magazine."

http://www.usatoday.com/tech/product...y_x.htm?csp=34

-- Imhotep
 
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Steven L Umbach
Guest
Posts: n/a
 
      05-17-2006
I have been using Beta 2 and have not noticed the severity to the point
where I have had to reboot the computer. The feature is a security option
that can be turned off in Local Security Policy if the user wishes to and
would rather accept the risk of doing so though and there will probably be
an adequate explanation for those who want to if they access built in help.

It will be interesting to see where users and what percentage draw the line
between convenience and security as my guess is that Vista will have UAC
enabled in the final version and it should be. I don't know however if there
will be an exception list to run certain tasks without the prompt that could
include MD5 hashes of executable files that a local administrator specifies
[similar to software firewall application rules] and possibly even exempt
users that could only be designated by the built in administrator account.
Typically all or nothing approaches are not received well even with the best
of intentions. --- Steve


"Imhotep" <(E-Mail Removed)> wrote in message
news:(E-Mail Removed) ...
> "SEATTLE - An annoying surprise awaits 2 million consumers expected to
> enthusiastically step forward in the next few weeks to help Microsoft test
> its new Windows Vista PC operating system.
>
> Volunteers will test Vista Beta 2, a near-final version of the much-hyped
> upgrade of Windows. The testing is the last step leading up to Vista's
> broad consumer release, scheduled for January.
>
> Beta 2 testers can expect to encounter an obtrusive security feature,
> called
> User Account Control (UAC). Designed to prevent intruders from performing
> harmful tasks, the feature grays out the computer screen, then prods you
> to
> confirm that you really want to do certain functions.
>
> In early test versions, the queries crop up so often that they interrupt
> routine tasks, such as changing the time clock or deleting shortcuts. And
> UAC sometimes triggers an endless loop of dialogue boxes that can be
> curtailed only by rebooting, says Paul Thurrott, news editor of Windows IT
> Pro magazine."
>
> http://www.usatoday.com/tech/product...y_x.htm?csp=34
>
> -- Imhotep



 
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Alun Jones
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Posts: n/a
 
      05-17-2006
Imhotep wrote:
> "SEATTLE - An annoying surprise awaits 2 million consumers expected to
> enthusiastically step forward in the next few weeks to help Microsoft
> test its new Windows Vista PC operating system.


Beta software has bugs. Wow. In other news, rain falls downward and makes
things wet.

Alun.
~~~~
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Sheik Yurbhuti
Guest
Posts: n/a
 
      05-17-2006
-----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE-----
Hash: RIPEMD160

Alun Jones wrote:

> Imhotep wrote:
>> "SEATTLE - An annoying surprise awaits 2 million consumers expected to
>> enthusiastically step forward in the next few weeks to help Microsoft
>> test its new Windows Vista PC operating system.

>
> Beta software has bugs. Wow. In other news, rain falls downward and
> makes things wet.


Beta bugs, especially second or third round beta bugs, don't generally
cripple an operating system entirely with nested, looping dialog boxes. If
that's actually true, and not a bit of "poetic license" or a definition of
the author's patience level.

And rain doesn't always fall downward.
-----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE-----

iD8DBQFEap1Kno5iexlRIBERAysFAJ4voVl5HeyNNIXGK6qSjE yhnG6WBQCeJEIZ
C281ejHGqAp+YhF4+SmgwzE=
=SMAE
-----END PGP SIGNATURE-----

 
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Imhotep
Guest
Posts: n/a
 
      05-17-2006
Sheik Yurbhuti wrote:

> -----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE-----
> Hash: RIPEMD160
>
> Alun Jones wrote:
>
>> Imhotep wrote:
>>> "SEATTLE - An annoying surprise awaits 2 million consumers expected to
>>> enthusiastically step forward in the next few weeks to help Microsoft
>>> test its new Windows Vista PC operating system.

>>
>> Beta software has bugs. Wow. In other news, rain falls downward and
>> makes things wet.

>
> Beta bugs, especially second or third round beta bugs, don't generally
> cripple an operating system entirely with nested, looping dialog boxes. If
> that's actually true, and not a bit of "poetic license" or a definition of
> the author's patience level.


....absolutely, they *shouldn't*...Do you suppose I should, warn Alum Jones
to close his mouth so he does not drown in the falling rain?

-- Imhotep

 
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Roger Abell [MVP]
Guest
Posts: n/a
 
      05-17-2006
My own feeling is that the jury is (not yet formed but effectively) still
out
on consumer acceptance of the final form of this feature. Once the
behavior is refined for release, AIUI the intent is for people that use an
admin account as their normal login to not imperil their machine by so
doing, and yet when they do activate something that does require use
of their admin privs they will be allowed to do so.
Now, in the current and prior builds many testers do find the feature
to be obnoxious. But then those testers are characteristically doing all
sorts of things that use their admin privs (exploring all the config
settings,
installing components, etc.) so perhaps the current test sample is not
characteristic of the consumer base that will only occassionally be
doing something requiring the elevated privs.

"Imhotep" <(E-Mail Removed)> wrote in message
news:(E-Mail Removed) ...
> "SEATTLE - An annoying surprise awaits 2 million consumers expected to
> enthusiastically step forward in the next few weeks to help Microsoft test
> its new Windows Vista PC operating system.
>
> Volunteers will test Vista Beta 2, a near-final version of the much-hyped
> upgrade of Windows. The testing is the last step leading up to Vista's
> broad consumer release, scheduled for January.
>
> Beta 2 testers can expect to encounter an obtrusive security feature,
> called
> User Account Control (UAC). Designed to prevent intruders from performing
> harmful tasks, the feature grays out the computer screen, then prods you
> to
> confirm that you really want to do certain functions.
>
> In early test versions, the queries crop up so often that they interrupt
> routine tasks, such as changing the time clock or deleting shortcuts. And
> UAC sometimes triggers an endless loop of dialogue boxes that can be
> curtailed only by rebooting, says Paul Thurrott, news editor of Windows IT
> Pro magazine."
>
> http://www.usatoday.com/tech/product...y_x.htm?csp=34
>
> -- Imhotep



 
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Steven L Umbach
Guest
Posts: n/a
 
      05-17-2006
I am not real hopeful. Consider that a lot if not the majority of drivers
will not wear their seat belts which is an action that can save their life
or prevent great bodily harm. Hence we now have air bags that added cost to
the purchase of a car. Consumers are waiting for MS to implement an air bag
in the operating system. --- Steve


"Roger Abell [MVP]" <(E-Mail Removed)> wrote in message
news:(E-Mail Removed)...
> My own feeling is that the jury is (not yet formed but effectively) still
> out
> on consumer acceptance of the final form of this feature. Once the
> behavior is refined for release, AIUI the intent is for people that use an
> admin account as their normal login to not imperil their machine by so
> doing, and yet when they do activate something that does require use
> of their admin privs they will be allowed to do so.
> Now, in the current and prior builds many testers do find the feature
> to be obnoxious. But then those testers are characteristically doing all
> sorts of things that use their admin privs (exploring all the config
> settings,
> installing components, etc.) so perhaps the current test sample is not
> characteristic of the consumer base that will only occassionally be
> doing something requiring the elevated privs.
>
> "Imhotep" <(E-Mail Removed)> wrote in message
> news:(E-Mail Removed) ...
>> "SEATTLE - An annoying surprise awaits 2 million consumers expected to
>> enthusiastically step forward in the next few weeks to help Microsoft
>> test
>> its new Windows Vista PC operating system.
>>
>> Volunteers will test Vista Beta 2, a near-final version of the much-hyped
>> upgrade of Windows. The testing is the last step leading up to Vista's
>> broad consumer release, scheduled for January.
>>
>> Beta 2 testers can expect to encounter an obtrusive security feature,
>> called
>> User Account Control (UAC). Designed to prevent intruders from performing
>> harmful tasks, the feature grays out the computer screen, then prods you
>> to
>> confirm that you really want to do certain functions.
>>
>> In early test versions, the queries crop up so often that they interrupt
>> routine tasks, such as changing the time clock or deleting shortcuts. And
>> UAC sometimes triggers an endless loop of dialogue boxes that can be
>> curtailed only by rebooting, says Paul Thurrott, news editor of Windows
>> IT
>> Pro magazine."
>>
>> http://www.usatoday.com/tech/product...y_x.htm?csp=34
>>
>> -- Imhotep

>
>



 
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Todd H.
Guest
Posts: n/a
 
      05-17-2006
"Steven L Umbach" <(E-Mail Removed)> writes:

> I am not real hopeful. Consider that a lot if not the majority of drivers
> will not wear their seat belts which is an action that can save their life
> or prevent great bodily harm. Hence we now have air bags that added cost to
> the purchase of a car. Consumers are waiting for MS to implement an air bag
> in the operating system. --- Steve


What was especially ironic and stupid about the original air bag
mandate is the paradox that
a) in the US, manufacturers were forced to design to a spect
that would restrain an unbelted passenger
but
b) as we learned through decapitations, blindings, and
maimings, first generation airbags especially those in the
US of the full deployment variety were totally unsafe to an
unbelted occupant too close the steering wheel.

Good times, eh?

That paradox has been corrected with low deployment force bags, and
additions of seat occupancy sensors and defeatable deployment for
passenger side bags, etc. But still, dont' think for a minute that
the airbag mandate doesn't have the grubby paws of the airbag
manufacturer's lobby all over it, and don't think for a moment that
for the same incremental increase in cost of an auto, there aren't
design improvements that would yield more overall safety than an
airbag in every steering column.

At least new cars aren't shipping with bombs in the steering columns
that'd snap grandma in half or pop infants' heads off.

Best Regards,
--
Todd H.
http://www.toddh.net/
 
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Unruh
Guest
Posts: n/a
 
      05-17-2006
"Steven L Umbach" <(E-Mail Removed)> writes:

>I am not real hopeful. Consider that a lot if not the majority of drivers
>will not wear their seat belts which is an action that can save their life
>or prevent great bodily harm. Hence we now have air bags that added cost to
>the purchase of a car. Consumers are waiting for MS to implement an air bag
>in the operating system. --- Steve


And if those airbags caused you to have to restart your car four or five
times a day....


>"Roger Abell [MVP]" <(E-Mail Removed)> wrote in message
>news:(E-Mail Removed)...
>> My own feeling is that the jury is (not yet formed but effectively) still
>> out
>> on consumer acceptance of the final form of this feature. Once the
>> behavior is refined for release, AIUI the intent is for people that use an
>> admin account as their normal login to not imperil their machine by so
>> doing, and yet when they do activate something that does require use
>> of their admin privs they will be allowed to do so.
>> Now, in the current and prior builds many testers do find the feature
>> to be obnoxious. But then those testers are characteristically doing all
>> sorts of things that use their admin privs (exploring all the config
>> settings,
>> installing components, etc.) so perhaps the current test sample is not
>> characteristic of the consumer base that will only occassionally be
>> doing something requiring the elevated privs.
>>
>> "Imhotep" <(E-Mail Removed)> wrote in message
>> news:(E-Mail Removed) ...
>>> "SEATTLE - An annoying surprise awaits 2 million consumers expected to
>>> enthusiastically step forward in the next few weeks to help Microsoft
>>> test
>>> its new Windows Vista PC operating system.
>>>
>>> Volunteers will test Vista Beta 2, a near-final version of the much-hyped
>>> upgrade of Windows. The testing is the last step leading up to Vista's
>>> broad consumer release, scheduled for January.
>>>
>>> Beta 2 testers can expect to encounter an obtrusive security feature,
>>> called
>>> User Account Control (UAC). Designed to prevent intruders from performing
>>> harmful tasks, the feature grays out the computer screen, then prods you
>>> to
>>> confirm that you really want to do certain functions.
>>>
>>> In early test versions, the queries crop up so often that they interrupt
>>> routine tasks, such as changing the time clock or deleting shortcuts. And
>>> UAC sometimes triggers an endless loop of dialogue boxes that can be
>>> curtailed only by rebooting, says Paul Thurrott, news editor of Windows
>>> IT
>>> Pro magazine."
>>>
>>> http://www.usatoday.com/tech/product...y_x.htm?csp=34
>>>
>>> -- Imhotep

>>
>>



 
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Joe Richards [MVP]
Guest
Posts: n/a
 
      05-18-2006
I agree, it is annoying but the folks using it right now are doing all sorts of
things they may not be doing after they have it running for a month or two and
are "stable". I noticed that the UAC was ****ing me right off until all of a
sudden I didn't reload the machine for a week or so and I realized I went a day
or two without seeing it at all because I was just using the machine after I had
stabilized.... Getting through that few days though is going to be trying for
some folks.

And honestly, I almost got to the point when reloading a lot where I wasn't even
looking at the prompts anymore and I was just clicking. At that point, it has
completely lost its effectiveness as a security feature.


--
Joe Richards Microsoft MVP Windows Server Directory Services
Author of O'Reilly Active Directory Third Edition
www.joeware.net


---O'Reilly Active Directory Third Edition now available---

http://www.joeware.net/win/ad3e.htm



Roger Abell [MVP] wrote:
> My own feeling is that the jury is (not yet formed but effectively) still
> out
> on consumer acceptance of the final form of this feature. Once the
> behavior is refined for release, AIUI the intent is for people that use an
> admin account as their normal login to not imperil their machine by so
> doing, and yet when they do activate something that does require use
> of their admin privs they will be allowed to do so.
> Now, in the current and prior builds many testers do find the feature
> to be obnoxious. But then those testers are characteristically doing all
> sorts of things that use their admin privs (exploring all the config
> settings,
> installing components, etc.) so perhaps the current test sample is not
> characteristic of the consumer base that will only occassionally be
> doing something requiring the elevated privs.
>
> "Imhotep" <(E-Mail Removed)> wrote in message
> news:(E-Mail Removed) ...
>> "SEATTLE - An annoying surprise awaits 2 million consumers expected to
>> enthusiastically step forward in the next few weeks to help Microsoft test
>> its new Windows Vista PC operating system.
>>
>> Volunteers will test Vista Beta 2, a near-final version of the much-hyped
>> upgrade of Windows. The testing is the last step leading up to Vista's
>> broad consumer release, scheduled for January.
>>
>> Beta 2 testers can expect to encounter an obtrusive security feature,
>> called
>> User Account Control (UAC). Designed to prevent intruders from performing
>> harmful tasks, the feature grays out the computer screen, then prods you
>> to
>> confirm that you really want to do certain functions.
>>
>> In early test versions, the queries crop up so often that they interrupt
>> routine tasks, such as changing the time clock or deleting shortcuts. And
>> UAC sometimes triggers an endless loop of dialogue boxes that can be
>> curtailed only by rebooting, says Paul Thurrott, news editor of Windows IT
>> Pro magazine."
>>
>> http://www.usatoday.com/tech/product...y_x.htm?csp=34
>>
>> -- Imhotep

>
>

 
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