«

if you don't want to read this all just skip to the question at the
end.

about a year ago i switched to a pc. when i did this a guy i knew said
it was absolutely necessary to get a firewall and some antiviral
program. so i ignored him.

last week i decided to finally protect my machine and found some
reviews on antiviral programs etc. the Shield was ranked very high so i
purchased it.

ironically i must have been infected either right after of right before
i installed it. soon my OS was giving me notifications that i was
infected. a process called "iexplore" was always hanging up my machine
when i tried to restart. no, this was not from me launching Internet
explorer. i use firefox. a program called spywarequake was generous
enough to have installed itself as well.

so, i ran the shield on my system. the whole thing. and it didn't' do a
damn thing. in fact the machine just crashed after about an hour of
scanning.

long story short, i did some research and found a way to manually
remove spywarequake:
http://www.sunbelt-software.com/spyw...keRemoval.html

it has never appeared again and my system has stopped saying i'm
infected. however, a process called "iexpore" was still hangin me up
when i did a restart. i feel like my problems are not completely
solved.

almost forgot, after this my OS was behaving funny. and i did read that
spywarequake could mess with your OS. anyway i tried to do a reinstall
and my machine got hung up again. would no recognize the CD-rom.
finally i got a reinstall from an external cd-rom.

MY QUESTION:
is there a frighten and scam angle to these antiviral programs? i mean
this program did absolutely nothing for me. they took my money.
apparently i "need" them. but the reality i'm experiencing is something
like this. don't download stuff from sketchy porn sites.

On 14 Apr 2006 10:04:36 -0700, wrote:
>
> MY QUESTION:
> is there a frighten and scam angle to these antiviral programs? i mean
> this program did absolutely nothing for me. they took my money.
> apparently i "need" them. but the reality i'm experiencing is something
> like this. don't download stuff from sketchy porn sites.

Window OSs running without firewalls/antivirus/worm/malware protection
do not run long before becoming infected when connected to the net
regardless of where you might surf.

Some malware has evolved which will disable your AV software. As long
as you are running that Microsoft OS, your odds of getting infections
are real good. Your AntiVirus software is like a car alarm. It works
lots of the time, but once in awhile, you get a breakin.

Once infected, you best choice is format, clean install from cd,
install/enable firewall, download AV database/update, get your OS
updates. There have been articles on how systems were infected while
downloading the updates to prevent the infection.

So what do you do if you want to continue to use your OS.

Buy a router to provide Network Address Translation between you and
your computer. That is your first line of defence. Now worms/malware
crawing the net can not find your computer behind the router to infect
you while you get your antivirus and OS updates installed.

Next, you install some third party mail reader and browsers to help
reduce to malware entry points.

Oh yes, you need to have your AV software getting update every hour
if not sooner.

Then create a user account without system privledges. That is the
account you always use unless doing some updates or installing
software.


At this point, your system is like like driving in a demolition derby.
You have beefed up your car, installed crash bars, using a seat belt
crash helment and crash padding.
Now you can plan on getting knocked out of the race by a Zero Day
Exploit or getting infected with some malware.

My choice, drive with a more secure OS.

From: <>

| if you don't want to read this all just skip to the question at the
| end.
|
| about a year ago i switched to a pc. when i did this a guy i knew said
| it was absolutely necessary to get a firewall and some antiviral
| program. so i ignored him.
|
| last week i decided to finally protect my machine and found some
| reviews on antiviral programs etc. the Shield was ranked very high so i
| purchased it.
|
| ironically i must have been infected either right after of right before
| i installed it. soon my OS was giving me notifications that i was
| infected. a process called "iexplore" was always hanging up my machine
| when i tried to restart. no, this was not from me launching Internet
| explorer. i use firefox. a program called spywarequake was generous
| enough to have installed itself as well.
|
| so, i ran the shield on my system. the whole thing. and it didn't' do a
| damn thing. in fact the machine just crashed after about an hour of
| scanning.
|
| long story short, i did some research and found a way to manually
| remove spywarequake:
| http://www.sunbelt-software.com/spyw...keRemoval.html
|
| it has never appeared again and my system has stopped saying i'm
| infected. however, a process called "iexpore" was still hangin me up
| when i did a restart. i feel like my problems are not completely
| solved.
|
| almost forgot, after this my OS was behaving funny. and i did read that
| spywarequake could mess with your OS. anyway i tried to do a reinstall
| and my machine got hung up again. would no recognize the CD-rom.
| finally i got a reinstall from an external cd-rom.
|
| MY QUESTION:
| is there a frighten and scam angle to these antiviral programs? i mean
| this program did absolutely nothing for me. they took my money.
| apparently i "need" them. but the reality i'm experiencing is something
| like this. don't download stuff from sketchy porn sites.

The Shield Pro is junk. While it is not listed on Spyware warrioor as a Rogue like
WinAntivuris is SpywareQuake is listed as a Rogue anti spyware application.

http://www.spywarewarrior.com/rogue_anti-spyware.htm

Next time check with professionals. You would have been pointed to reputable software such
as Kaspersky or NOD32 anti virus software.

--
Dave
http://www.claymania.com/removal-trojan-adware.html
http://www.ik-cs.com/got-a-virus.htm

On 14 Apr 2006 10:04:36 -0700, wrote:

>MY QUESTION:
>is there a frighten and scam angle to these antiviral programs?
##############################################
I think that's part of it. I haven't run an AV program on in years.
I feel I know how to protect myself without one. I do run spybot S&D
though and most times it says Congratulations, no problems found.

Hi cporro - To answer your specific question - Yes, there is although it's
normally more prevalent with regard to anti-malware programs than to
anti-viral ones. Take a look at my Blog, addy below in my signature, for
some links to things you should read and the minimum set of actions you need
to take to adequately protect your system.

--
Regards, Jim Byrd, MS-MVP/DTS/AH-VSOP
My Blog, Defending Your Machine, here:
http://DefendingYourMachine.blogspot.com/



<> wrote in message
news: ups.com
|| if you don't want to read this all just skip to the question at the
|| end.
||
|| about a year ago i switched to a pc. when i did this a guy i knew said
|| it was absolutely necessary to get a firewall and some antiviral
|| program. so i ignored him.
||
|| last week i decided to finally protect my machine and found some
|| reviews on antiviral programs etc. the Shield was ranked very high so i
|| purchased it.
||
|| ironically i must have been infected either right after of right before
|| i installed it. soon my OS was giving me notifications that i was
|| infected. a process called "iexplore" was always hanging up my machine
|| when i tried to restart. no, this was not from me launching Internet
|| explorer. i use firefox. a program called spywarequake was generous
|| enough to have installed itself as well.
||
|| so, i ran the shield on my system. the whole thing. and it didn't' do a
|| damn thing. in fact the machine just crashed after about an hour of
|| scanning.
||
|| long story short, i did some research and found a way to manually
|| remove spywarequake:
|| http://www.sunbelt-software.com/spyw...keRemoval.html
||
|| it has never appeared again and my system has stopped saying i'm
|| infected. however, a process called "iexpore" was still hangin me up
|| when i did a restart. i feel like my problems are not completely
|| solved.
||
|| almost forgot, after this my OS was behaving funny. and i did read that
|| spywarequake could mess with your OS. anyway i tried to do a reinstall
|| and my machine got hung up again. would no recognize the CD-rom.
|| finally i got a reinstall from an external cd-rom.
||
|| MY QUESTION:
|| is there a frighten and scam angle to these antiviral programs? i mean
|| this program did absolutely nothing for me. they took my money.
|| apparently i "need" them. but the reality i'm experiencing is something
|| like this. don't download stuff from sketchy porn sites.

wrote:

> if you don't want to read this all just skip to the question at the
> end.
>
> about a year ago i switched to a pc. when i did this a guy i knew said
> it was absolutely necessary to get a firewall and some antiviral
> program. so i ignored him.
>
> last week i decided to finally protect my machine and found some
> reviews on antiviral programs etc. the Shield was ranked very high so i
> purchased it.
>
> ironically i must have been infected either right after of right before
> i installed it. soon my OS was giving me notifications that i was
> infected. a process called "iexplore" was always hanging up my machine
> when i tried to restart. no, this was not from me launching Internet
> explorer. i use firefox. a program called spywarequake was generous
> enough to have installed itself as well.
>
> so, i ran the shield on my system. the whole thing. and it didn't' do a
> damn thing. in fact the machine just crashed after about an hour of
> scanning.
>
> long story short, i did some research and found a way to manually
> remove spywarequake:
> http://www.sunbelt-software.com/spyw...keRemoval.html
>
> it has never appeared again and my system has stopped saying i'm
> infected. however, a process called "iexpore" was still hangin me up
> when i did a restart. i feel like my problems are not completely
> solved.
>
> almost forgot, after this my OS was behaving funny. and i did read that
> spywarequake could mess with your OS. anyway i tried to do a reinstall
> and my machine got hung up again. would no recognize the CD-rom.
> finally i got a reinstall from an external cd-rom.
>
> MY QUESTION:
> is there a frighten and scam angle to these antiviral programs? i mean
> this program did absolutely nothing for me. they took my money.
> apparently i "need" them. but the reality i'm experiencing is something
> like this. don't download stuff from sketchy porn sites.


Honestly, the whole damn PC industry has become a scam....

Imhotep

On Fri, 14 Apr 2006 18:31:35 GMT, donnie <> wrote:

>I think that's part of it. I haven't run an AV program on in years.
>I feel I know how to protect myself without one. I do run spybot S&D
>though and most times it says Congratulations, no problems found.

I second that, a lot of problems I get are a result of AV software
and it sucks the guts out of some of my clients machines. Its
lost its way, as the threats today are different to when this stuff
was concieved and its been patched and extended
and bloated with all sorts of functionality leaving less for
applications.

Although S&D is good, I switched to the PC tools product
which is commercial and updated more often. It sorted out
spyaxe for a client and looked useful.

Process monitor from sysinternals is the final solution to most
problems, but these tools are only good for experienced users.

Otherwise, the best precaution is removing any executable
attachments from email at the server. 'virus scanning' is a
waste of time, kill 'em all.

My need for browser toolbars and animated 'screen savers'
and advertisment supported software is not detectable.
--
Jim Watt
http://www.gibnet.com

cporro wrote:

<snippage>

> ironically i must have been infected either right after of right before
> i installed it. soon my OS was giving me notifications that i was
> infected.

Or, you had been infected for a long while but somehting changed that
might bring it to your attention. Like some sort of antivirus software
only partially removing a piece of malware that previously managed to hide
itself from you.

Things aren't always as they appear, especially when dealing with complex
machines.

> a process called "iexplore" was always hanging up my machine
> when i tried to restart. no, this was not from me launching Internet
> explorer. i use firefox. a program called spywarequake was generous
> enough to have installed itself as well.

Iexplore runs as a sort of "window manager" on windows systems. It gives
you much of that pretty user interface, and thus the reason it can never
be FULLY uninstalled from a Windows box.

> so, i ran the shield on my system. the whole thing. and it didn't' do a
> damn thing. in fact the machine just crashed after about an hour of
> scanning.
>
> long story short, i did some research and found a way to manually remove
> spywarequake:
> http://www.sunbelt-software.com/spyw...keRemoval.html

FWIW, the best course of action is to not get infected in the first place.

Not to say anything about your particular incident(s), but no software can
ever be expected to reliably repair a damaged system. Sometimes it's
impossible. Usually it's impossible to return your system to its
"pristine" state, but possible to get it to a place that it's working
properly.

> it has never appeared again and my system has stopped saying i'm infected.
> however, a process called "iexpore" was still hangin me up when i did a
> restart. i feel like my problems are not completely solved.

They may never be without you restoring your system from clean backups.

You do have backups, don't you?

> almost forgot, after this my OS was behaving funny. and i did read that
> spywarequake could mess with your OS. anyway i tried to do a reinstall and
> my machine got hung up again. would no recognize the CD-rom. finally i got
> a reinstall from an external cd-rom.

If you're "reinstalling" over top of an old copy of Windows you're
probably either going to make no difference at all, or cause yourself more
problems as whatever is messing with your system breaks. Yes, it sounds
odd, but viruses have a vested interest in keeping your machine up and if
you mess with them you run the risk of making the machine unusable.

Best to completely wipe the drive and start over clean, from a known clean
install media, without any remnants of the old copy of your operating
system anywhere around.

>
> MY QUESTION:
> is there a frighten and scam angle to these antiviral programs? i mean

Of course. There's good used car salesmen, and bad. Professional home
re-modelers, and fly-by-nights. Good doctors, and quacks. Just like any
business there's a bad element. Although there may be a few more in the
computer security business because most people are far less ignorant
about brains surgery, cars, and additions to their houses than they are
computer security.

There IS a lot of FUD and propaganda out there. Best you can do is study
and ask questions where independent thinkers hang out.

> this program did absolutely nothing for me. they took my money. apparently
> i "need" them. but the reality i'm experiencing is something like this.
> don't download stuff from sketchy porn sites.

Are there porn sites that AREN'T "sketchy"? <grinning>

"Imhotep" <> wrote in message
news:IMGdnTDO87cQ5N3ZRVn-...
> wrote:
>
> > if you don't want to read this all just skip to the question at the
> > end.
> >
> > about a year ago i switched to a pc. when i did this a guy i knew said
> > it was absolutely necessary to get a firewall and some antiviral
> > program. so i ignored him.
> >
> > last week i decided to finally protect my machine and found some
> > reviews on antiviral programs etc. the Shield was ranked very high so i
> > purchased it.
> >
> > ironically i must have been infected either right after of right before
> > i installed it. soon my OS was giving me notifications that i was
> > infected. a process called "iexplore" was always hanging up my machine
> > when i tried to restart. no, this was not from me launching Internet
> > explorer. i use firefox. a program called spywarequake was generous
> > enough to have installed itself as well.
> >
> > so, i ran the shield on my system. the whole thing. and it didn't' do a
> > damn thing. in fact the machine just crashed after about an hour of
> > scanning.
> >
> > long story short, i did some research and found a way to manually
> > remove spywarequake:
> > http://www.sunbelt-software.com/spyw...keRemoval.html
> >
> > it has never appeared again and my system has stopped saying i'm
> > infected. however, a process called "iexpore" was still hangin me up
> > when i did a restart. i feel like my problems are not completely
> > solved.
> >
> > almost forgot, after this my OS was behaving funny. and i did read that
> > spywarequake could mess with your OS. anyway i tried to do a reinstall
> > and my machine got hung up again. would no recognize the CD-rom.
> > finally i got a reinstall from an external cd-rom.
> >
> > MY QUESTION:
> > is there a frighten and scam angle to these antiviral programs? i mean
> > this program did absolutely nothing for me. they took my money.
> > apparently i "need" them. but the reality i'm experiencing is something
> > like this. don't download stuff from sketchy porn sites.
>
>
> Honestly, the whole damn PC industry has become a scam....
>
> Imhotep

Hear hear. Got a nice pension and big lump sum arriving in a year's time.
)))))))))))))) and my next PC is definitely going to be a Mac with all the
trimmings - especially the Adobe ones. Might be able to run a filter in
Photoshop without going out and doing my shopping to pass the time!

You've got no idea what 'slow' means unless your running a ten-year-old Dell
contraption!

And yes - I think most spyware and viruses are written by the anti-virus
industry to keep their businesses going!

If proof were found, it'd be the fraud of the bloody century!

Memo: This is Nemo!

"Borked Pseudo Mailed" <> wrote in message
news: d.net...
> cporro wrote:
>
> <snippage>
>
> > ironically i must have been infected either right after of right before
> > i installed it. soon my OS was giving me notifications that i was
> > infected.
>
> Or, you had been infected for a long while but somehting changed that
> might bring it to your attention. Like some sort of antivirus software
> only partially removing a piece of malware that previously managed to hide
> itself from you.
>
> Things aren't always as they appear, especially when dealing with complex
> machines.
>
> > a process called "iexplore" was always hanging up my machine
> > when i tried to restart. no, this was not from me launching Internet
> > explorer. i use firefox. a program called spywarequake was generous
> > enough to have installed itself as well.
>
> Iexplore runs as a sort of "window manager" on windows systems. It gives
> you much of that pretty user interface, and thus the reason it can never
> be FULLY uninstalled from a Windows box.
>
> > so, i ran the shield on my system. the whole thing. and it didn't' do a
> > damn thing. in fact the machine just crashed after about an hour of
> > scanning.
> >
> > long story short, i did some research and found a way to manually remove
> > spywarequake:
> > http://www.sunbelt-software.com/spyw...keRemoval.html
>
> FWIW, the best course of action is to not get infected in the first place.

>
> Not to say anything about your particular incident(s), but no software can
> ever be expected to reliably repair a damaged system. Sometimes it's
> impossible. Usually it's impossible to return your system to its
> "pristine" state, but possible to get it to a place that it's working
> properly.
>
> > it has never appeared again and my system has stopped saying i'm
infected.
> > however, a process called "iexpore" was still hangin me up when i did a
> > restart. i feel like my problems are not completely solved.
>
> They may never be without you restoring your system from clean backups.
>
> You do have backups, don't you?
>
> > almost forgot, after this my OS was behaving funny. and i did read that
> > spywarequake could mess with your OS. anyway i tried to do a reinstall
and
> > my machine got hung up again. would no recognize the CD-rom. finally i
got
> > a reinstall from an external cd-rom.
>
> If you're "reinstalling" over top of an old copy of Windows you're
> probably either going to make no difference at all, or cause yourself more
> problems as whatever is messing with your system breaks. Yes, it sounds
> odd, but viruses have a vested interest in keeping your machine up and if
> you mess with them you run the risk of making the machine unusable.
>
> Best to completely wipe the drive and start over clean, from a known clean
> install media, without any remnants of the old copy of your operating
> system anywhere around.
>
> >
> > MY QUESTION:
> > is there a frighten and scam angle to these antiviral programs? i mean
>
> Of course. There's good used car salesmen, and bad. Professional home
> re-modelers, and fly-by-nights. Good doctors, and quacks. Just like any
> business there's a bad element. Although there may be a few more in the
> computer security business because most people are far less ignorant
> about brains surgery, cars, and additions to their houses than they are
> computer security.
>
> There IS a lot of FUD and propaganda out there. Best you can do is study
> and ask questions where independent thinkers hang out.
>
> > this program did absolutely nothing for me. they took my money.
apparently
> > i "need" them. but the reality i'm experiencing is something like this.
> > don't download stuff from sketchy porn sites.
>
> Are there porn sites that AREN'T "sketchy"? <grinning>
>

Who needs porn *sites* when there's the nice free Usenet? ;o)

For how much longer I dunno. Has it occurred to anyone else that blog sites
might be the beginning of an attempt to shut the Usenet by providing a
better-known replacement?