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Feedback appreciated for a new design I am working on.

 
 
Chaddy2222
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      06-05-2006
Hi all.
I am currently re-designing my site to use a CSS based layout. I was
just wandering if anyone could give me some feedback on how it looks,
suggestions on how it could be improved that sort of thing.
The test page is at: http://freewebdesign.cjb.cc/test
Only the index page is up at this stage, I will add content and build
the site from the index page once it's working well.


--
Regards Chad. http://freewebdesign.cjb.cc

 
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Travis Newbury
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      06-05-2006
Chaddy2222 wrote:
> I am currently re-designing my site to use a CSS based layout. I was
> just wandering if anyone could give me some feedback on how it looks,
> suggestions on how it could be improved that sort of thing.
> The test page is at: http://freewebdesign.cjb.cc/test
> Only the index page is up at this stage, I will add content and build
> the site from the index page once it's working well.


impressive...

 
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Chaddy2222
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      06-05-2006

Travis Newbury wrote:
> Chaddy2222 wrote:
> > I am currently re-designing my site to use a CSS based layout. I was
> > just wandering if anyone could give me some feedback on how it looks,
> > suggestions on how it could be improved that sort of thing.
> > The test page is at: http://freewebdesign.cjb.cc/test
> > Only the index page is up at this stage, I will add content and build
> > the site from the index page once it's working well.

>
> impressive...

Thanks...
--
Regards Chad. http://freewebdesign.cjb.cc

 
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Rik
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Posts: n/a
 
      06-05-2006
Chaddy2222 wrote:
> Hi all.
> I am currently re-designing my site to use a CSS based layout. I was
> just wandering if anyone could give me some feedback on how it looks,
> suggestions on how it could be improved that sort of thing.
> The test page is at: http://freewebdesign.cjb.cc/test
> Only the index page is up at this stage, I will add content and build
> the site from the index page once it's working well.


<meta http-equiv="Content-Type" content="application/xhtml+xml;
charset=ISO-8859-1" />

Hmmmmz, not sure wether the choice "application/xhtml+xml" was appropriate,
but I've forgotten the exact rules .

<div id="header"><h1>Free Web Design Online!</h1></div>

Why wrap it in a div? What layout are you giving it, that you cannot apply
to the h1 directly? Div's are nice, but terribly overused. If there's a
better tag, use it, maybe using a couple of different classes.

Navigation: it's actually a list, you might consider making it one,
allthough removing the standard browser presentation is a pain. You seems to
have started out like that, considering the seemingly useless:
list-style-type's in the "a" markup.

From a graphical point of view:

H1: try some padding on the left, I think that will look a lot better, but
that's personal taste.

The "navigation" at the top is not enough "seperated", in Opera 8.52 I can
hardly make out that it's not just one link. Also: try to be consistent in
the use of capital letters. Now it's mostly random.

Text color is OK to my young eyes, but I'd imagine that for some people i
could use a bit more contrast.

I'd suggest using this in the body:
<body>
<h1> Free Web Design Online!</h1>
<ul>
<li><a href="#" title="Home" class="on">Home</a></li>
<li><a href="index.html">About Us&nbsp;</a></li>
<li><a href="index.html">Web Design&nbsp;</a></li>
<li><a href="index.html">Contact us </a></li>
</ul>
<h2>Welcome To Free Web Design Online!</h2>
<p>This page is a template for the new look version of the site.<br />The
page has been created useing XHTML and CSS for better markup and
useability... We hope you like it.......</p>
<ul>
<li><a href="index.html">Contact us</a></li>
<li><a href="index.html">About us </a></li>
<li><a href="index.html">Example Sites&nbsp;</a></li>
</ul>
Copyright &copy; 2006 Free Web Design Online! All Rights Reserved.
</body>

And adjust your css accordingly.
About using lists: http://css.maxdesign.com.au/listamatic/ contains a lot of
examples of how to whip them into the shape you want.

I applaud the use of relative sizes for text instead of px (or even worse,
pt..).

Grtz,
--
Rik Wasmus


 
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Alan J. Flavell
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      06-05-2006
On Mon, 5 Jun 2006, Rik wrote:

> <meta http-equiv="Content-Type" content="application/xhtml+xml;
> charset=ISO-8859-1" />


Complete nonsense, I'm afraid.

> Hmmmmz, not sure wether the choice "application/xhtml+xml" was
> appropriate, but I've forgotten the exact rules .


There's no extra charge for checking the specifications before
making oneself look silly, you know. (Been there, done that...)


 
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Neredbojias
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Posts: n/a
 
      06-05-2006
To further the education of mankind, "Chaddy2222" <rockradio2000
@yahoo.com.au> vouchsafed:

> Hi all.
> I am currently re-designing my site to use a CSS based layout. I was
> just wandering if anyone could give me some feedback on how it looks,
> suggestions on how it could be improved that sort of thing.
> The test page is at: http://freewebdesign.cjb.cc/test
> Only the index page is up at this stage, I will add content and build
> the site from the index page once it's working well.


It looks okay if a little, uh, sparse.

Were I you, I'd forget the xhtml and use html strict, though. Despite
certain prognostications, xhtml is not going to replace html any time soon,
if ever.

I agree with the previous feedback about separating the links more, too.

--
Neredbojias
Infinity has its limits.
 
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Chaddy2222
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Posts: n/a
 
      06-05-2006

Rik wrote:
> Chaddy2222 wrote:
> > Hi all.
> > I am currently re-designing my site to use a CSS based layout. I was
> > just wandering if anyone could give me some feedback on how it looks,
> > suggestions on how it could be improved that sort of thing.
> > The test page is at: http://freewebdesign.cjb.cc/test
> > Only the index page is up at this stage, I will add content and build
> > the site from the index page once it's working well.

>
> <meta http-equiv="Content-Type" content="application/xhtml+xml;
> charset=ISO-8859-1" />
>
> Hmmmmz, not sure wether the choice "application/xhtml+xml" was appropriate,
> but I've forgotten the exact rules .

Well, it can be done, but a lot of people say that HTML4.01 strict
works just as well.
It's actually served as HTML but it has the XHTML info their. If IE had
better support for XHTML then the pages could be served up as XHTML
instead of HTML, but XHTML is not well supported yet.

>
> <div id="header"><h1>Free Web Design Online!</h1></div>
>
> Why wrap it in a div? What layout are you giving it, that you cannot apply
> to the h1 directly? Div's are nice, but terribly overused. If there's a
> better tag, use it, maybe using a couple of different classes.
>
> Navigation: it's actually a list, you might consider making it one,
> allthough removing the standard browser presentation is a pain. You seems to
> have started out like that, considering the seemingly useless:
> list-style-type's in the "a" markup.

Yeah, I removed the list from the navigation as I could not get the
page to validate with the list, now i've got it validating I will add
it back in.

>
> From a graphical point of view:
>
> H1: try some padding on the left, I think that will look a lot better, but
> that's personal taste.

I'll have a look in to that, thanks.

>
> The "navigation" at the top is not enough "seperated", in Opera 8.52 I can
> hardly make out that it's not just one link. Also: try to be consistent in
> the use of capital letters. Now it's mostly random.
>
> Text color is OK to my young eyes, but I'd imagine that for some people i
> could use a bit more contrast.
>
> I'd suggest using this in the body:
> <body>
> <h1> Free Web Design Online!</h1>
> <ul>
> <li><a href="#" title="Home" class="on">Home</a></li>
> <li><a href="index.html">About Us&nbsp;</a></li>
> <li><a href="index.html">Web Design&nbsp;</a></li>
> <li><a href="index.html">Contact us </a></li>
> </ul>
> <h2>Welcome To Free Web Design Online!</h2>

<snip>
Thanks for the list suggestion.

> And adjust your css accordingly.
> About using lists: http://css.maxdesign.com.au/listamatic/ contains a lot of
> examples of how to whip them into the shape you want.
>
> I applaud the use of relative sizes for text instead of px (or even worse,
> pt..).
>

Thanks. My current site at http://freewebdesign.cjb.cc can also be used
with user specific font sizes, however I was having trouble controling
issues such as keeping the font sizeing constant across all pages with
the old layout.
--
Regards Chad. http://freewebdesign.cjb.cc

 
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Rik
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Posts: n/a
 
      06-05-2006
Alan J. Flavell wrote:
> On Mon, 5 Jun 2006, Rik wrote:
>
>> <meta http-equiv="Content-Type" content="application/xhtml+xml;
>> charset=ISO-8859-1" />

>
> Complete nonsense, I'm afraid.
>
>> Hmmmmz, not sure wether the choice "application/xhtml+xml" was
>> appropriate, but I've forgotten the exact rules .

>
> There's no extra charge for checking the specifications before
> making oneself look silly, you know. (Been there, done that...)


I was trying to post a few usefull comments in a minimal amount of time, but
OK, here it is.
http://www.w3.org/TR/xhtml-media-typ...ml#media-types

While the content type IS application/xhtml+xml, you COULD use text/html,
for a good reason:

text/html:
Appendix C "HTML Compatibility Guidelines" summarizes "design guidelines for
authors who wish their XHTML documents to render on existing HTML user
agents". The use of 'text/html' for XHTML SHOULD be limited for the purpose
of rendering on existing HTML user agents, and SHOULD be limited to [XHTML1]
documents which follow the HTML Compatibility Guidelines. In particular,
'text/html' is NOT suitable for XHTML Family document types that adds
elements and attributes from foreign namespaces, such as XHTML+MathML
[XHTML+MathML].

That was the nagging in the back of my head. And now I will further prove to
you I'm lazy: I will NOT investigate which browsers are XHTML compliant, and
which aren't.

Grtz,
--
Rik Wasmus


 
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Steve Pugh
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Posts: n/a
 
      06-05-2006
Chaddy2222 wrote:
> Rik wrote:
> >
> > <meta http-equiv="Content-Type" content="application/xhtml+xml;
> > charset=ISO-8859-1" />
> >
> > Hmmmmz, not sure wether the choice "application/xhtml+xml" was
> > appropriate, but I've forgotten the exact rules .
> >

> Well, it can be done, but a lot of people say that HTML4.01 strict
> works just as well.
> It's actually served as HTML but it has the XHTML info their. If IE had
> better support for XHTML then the pages could be served up as XHTML
> instead of HTML, but XHTML is not well supported yet.


The real issue here is that your server is sending out content-type:
text/html so saying application/xhtml+xml is useless as the real http
header trumps the meta tag fake.

If you did send application/xhtml+xml in the real HTTP header then by
default IE wouldn't be able to render the page at all.

You've gone to the effort of putting some code into your pages that
conflicts with what your server says about the page, and which if it
was honoured would make the page unusable by a large segment of users.

So why did you bother?

Steve

 
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Alan J. Flavell
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Posts: n/a
 
      06-05-2006
On Mon, 5 Jun 2006, Rik wrote:

> Alan J. Flavell wrote:
> > On Mon, 5 Jun 2006, Rik wrote:
> >
> >> <meta http-equiv="Content-Type" content="application/xhtml+xml;
> >> charset=ISO-8859-1" />

> >
> > Complete nonsense, I'm afraid.


[...]

> I was trying to post a few usefull comments in a minimal amount of
> time, but OK, here it is.
> http://www.w3.org/TR/xhtml-media-typ...ml#media-types


I'm afraid you're missing the point.

> While the content type IS application/xhtml+xml, you COULD use
> text/html, for a good reason:


If you have provided a content-type of text/html from the server, then
a <meta http-equiv...> is far too late to be trying to change your
mind and say that it's really application/xhtml+xml

On the other hand, if you have provided a content-type of
application/xhtml+xml, then the rules for specifying the character
encoding will already have done their work and fixed the character
encoding, long before it gets to the point of seeing that bogus <meta
http-equiv...> that's possibly trying to make it be something else.

> text/html:
> Appendix C "HTML Compatibility Guidelines"


....for XHTML/1.0 only...

> summarizes "design guidelines for authors who wish their XHTML
> documents to render on existing HTML user agents".


We've done this part so often before, I'm not going to repeat the
arguments all over again; but they really aren't part of what it takes
to understand that:

> >> <meta http-equiv="Content-Type" content="application/xhtml+xml;
> >> charset=ISO-8859-1" />


is nonsense.

> That was the nagging in the back of my head. And now I will further
> prove to you I'm lazy: I will NOT investigate which browsers are
> XHTML compliant, and which aren't.


That wasn't any part of the specific problem, either.

*Even* if you could find a client implementation which accepted
text/html from the server, and changed its mind about content-type and
character encoding when it saw this ominous <meta http-equiv...> , it
would still be complete nonsense in terms of the WWW specifications.

 
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