Another Possibly Faulty Question in MCSA/MCSE 70-290 Training Kit

The problem lies in the explanation to this question, but if the explanation
is incorrect it throws off the question. Here is the question, correct
answer and the confusing part of the explanation in brief.

QUESTION
You have a USB-connected hard disk identified as drive H: on a computer
running Microsoft Windows Server 2003. Disk Defragmenter fails when you
attempt to defragment the hard disk. What is the most likelyk cause?

CORRECT ANSWER
The file system on drive H: is marked as dirty

EXPLANATION
Disk Defragmenter will fail if a volume's file system is marked as dirty.
If the volume's file system is marked as dirty, you must run chkdsk before
you can defragment the volume.


I examined the section in the MCSE/MCSA 70-290 training kit that refers to
defragmentation. Nowhere in the section does it say that defragmentation
will fail if the volume is dirty. It also says, and this is a direct quote
from the book, if the tool indicates that the volume is dirty, there may be
corruption and CHKDSK should be run before defragmenting.

The word difference is small..."may" and "should"...but quite a few of the
questions I'm encountering in the practice exams use small rephrasings to
confuse the test taker, or to make the answer harder to guess.

I'm open for explanations for this one. I'm just trying to pass the test
eventually.

CJH

> I'm open for explanations for this one. I'm just trying to pass the
> test eventually.

This is a problem I have with MS tests. They should admit that most techs
use a third party defragmenting tool like Diskkeeper.
--
aka
Doom MCNGP #38
Is that a burdizzo in your pocket or are you just glad to see me.

CBIC

"CBIC" <> wrote in message
news:...
>
> This is a problem I have with MS tests. They should admit that most techs
> use a third party defragmenting tool like Diskkeeper.

That won't help. In fact the question specifically refers to Disk
Defragmenter...the Microsoft tool. My beef is with the explanation, and how
it is incorrect and how it throws off the question.

CJH

In news:%,
CJH <chaselton AT gmail DOT com> embarrassed himself by saying:
> "CBIC" <> wrote in message
> news:...
>>
>> This is a problem I have with MS tests. They should admit that most
>> techs use a third party defragmenting tool like Diskkeeper.
>
> That won't help. In fact the question specifically refers to Disk
> Defragmenter...the Microsoft tool. My beef is with the explanation,
> and how it is incorrect and how it throws off the question.

Yeah sorry about that. I don't have an answer for you I just took this
opportunity to air my problem.
--
aka
Doom MCNGP #38
Is that a burdizzo in your pocket or are you just glad to see me.

CBIC

I think most of us have similar beefs with all exams, MS or otherwise. The
questions often seem to deviate from the knowledge base in a way that
doesn't help test your knowledge, but seems to deliberately try to confuse
the "testee" as to what the question is asking. On a Cisco test one of the
questions specified a server's IP address and subnet mask then asked which
of the four ip addresses in the answers were in the same subnet. Naturally,
I read the question to mean "which of the IP addresses in the answers are in
the same subnet as the server?" - otherwise, why include the information
about the server's address / mask? The answer was, none of the ip addresses
in the questions were in the same subnet as the server. But what the
question was asking was, which IP addresses were in the same subnet as EACH
OTHER! So the question was not written to test my knowedge of subnetting,
but to deceive me into answering incorrectly. MS test questions are no
different. On one hand, they need to mix it up so as to prevent
"rubber-stamped" answers. But they need to be sure the questions are clear
as to what is being asked. I still scored a 92 on the Cisco exam, so it
wasn't the one that failed the exam for me, but I wrote in my complaint
anyway (I figured out what they were really asking about an hour after I
finished the exam).

"CJH" <chaselton AT gmail DOT com> wrote in message
news:%...
>
> "CBIC" <> wrote in message
> news:...
>>
>> This is a problem I have with MS tests. They should admit that most techs
>> use a third party defragmenting tool like Diskkeeper.
>
> That won't help. In fact the question specifically refers to Disk
> Defragmenter...the Microsoft tool. My beef is with the explanation, and
> how it is incorrect and how it throws off the question.
>
>

Kurt

"CJH" <chaselton AT gmail DOT com> wrote:

> The problem lies in the explanation to this question, but if the
> explanation
> is incorrect it throws off the question. Here is the question, correct
> answer and the confusing part of the explanation in brief.
>
> QUESTION
> You have a USB-connected hard disk identified as drive H: on a computer
> running Microsoft Windows Server 2003. Disk Defragmenter fails when you
> attempt to defragment the hard disk. What is the most likelyk cause?
>
> CORRECT ANSWER
> The file system on drive H: is marked as dirty
>
> EXPLANATION
> Disk Defragmenter will fail if a volume's file system is marked as dirty.
> If the volume's file system is marked as dirty, you must run chkdsk before
> you can defragment the volume.
>
>
> I examined the section in the MCSE/MCSA 70-290 training kit that refers to
> defragmentation. Nowhere in the section does it say that defragmentation
> will fail if the volume is dirty. It also says, and this is a direct
> quote from the book, if the tool indicates that the volume is dirty, there
> may be corruption and CHKDSK should be run before defragmenting.
>
> The word difference is small..."may" and "should"...but quite a few of the
> questions I'm encountering in the practice exams use small rephrasings to
> confuse the test taker, or to make the answer harder to guess.
>
> I'm open for explanations for this one. I'm just trying to pass the test
> eventually.

First, if you really want to know the _right_ answer, then try it and see
what happens. Second, in any situation involving paper tests there's a
right way, a wrong way, and a Navy way, and to pass the test you have to
know the Navy (or in this case Microsoft) way, regardless of any logic or
any relation to reality.

Don't worry overly much about passing the test, worry about learning the
system on which you are being tested.

--
--John
to email, dial "usenet" and validate
(was jclarke at eye bee em dot net)

J. Clarke

Hi Kurt,
Good comments! Having been on both sides of this (being a test taker and
being someone that works in the certification group that creates the exams),
I can see where a lot of exams appear to be reading comprehension rather
than knowledge of what to do in a given instance. I also appreciate the
other comments about 3rd party tools that would be used rather than the tool
that comes "in the box".

We work hard with the experts that help us create exam items to make sure
the questions are relevant and well written. A lot of times, one or two
words in the stem (scenario) of the question make an answer right or wrong,
so paying close attention is vital.

For the 3rd party tools, we are measuring what capabilities are available
with the product to manage and maintain the environment, so we cover those
tools. While other tools may be available, we know the tools we provide will
be available. Once you know one tool, what it is meant to do and how it does
it, then the tool you use to perform the task becomes less significant. That
is, the people that hire you need to know you can do those tasks regardless
of how you do them.

--
--
Andy Ruth
Microsoft Learning

This posting is provided "AS IS" with no warranties, and confers no
rights.

"Kurt" <> wrote in message
news:...
>I think most of us have similar beefs with all exams, MS or otherwise. The
>questions often seem to deviate from the knowledge base in a way that
>doesn't help test your knowledge, but seems to deliberately try to confuse
>the "testee" as to what the question is asking. On a Cisco test one of the
>questions specified a server's IP address and subnet mask then asked which
>of the four ip addresses in the answers were in the same subnet. Naturally,
>I read the question to mean "which of the IP addresses in the answers are
>in the same subnet as the server?" - otherwise, why include the information
>about the server's address / mask? The answer was, none of the ip addresses
>in the questions were in the same subnet as the server. But what the
>question was asking was, which IP addresses were in the same subnet as EACH
>OTHER! So the question was not written to test my knowedge of subnetting,
>but to deceive me into answering incorrectly. MS test questions are no
>different. On one hand, they need to mix it up so as to prevent
>"rubber-stamped" answers. But they need to be sure the questions are clear
>as to what is being asked. I still scored a 92 on the Cisco exam, so it
>wasn't the one that failed the exam for me, but I wrote in my complaint
>anyway (I figured out what they were really asking about an hour after I
>finished the exam).
>
> "CJH" <chaselton AT gmail DOT com> wrote in message
> news:%...
>>
>> "CBIC" <> wrote in message
>> news:...
>>>
>>> This is a problem I have with MS tests. They should admit that most
>>> techs use a third party defragmenting tool like Diskkeeper.
>>
>> That won't help. In fact the question specifically refers to Disk
>> Defragmenter...the Microsoft tool. My beef is with the explanation, and
>> how it is incorrect and how it throws off the question.
>>
>>
>
>

Andy Ruth [MSFT]

"Andy Ruth [MSFT]" <> wrote in message
news:%...
> We work hard with the experts that help us create exam items to make sure
> the questions are relevant and well written. A lot of times, one or two
> words in the stem (scenario) of the question make an answer right or
> wrong, so paying close attention is vital.
>
Right, but the wording on the explanation on this question is incorrect.
Did you read my original post?

> For the 3rd party tools, we are measuring what capabilities are available
> with the product to manage and maintain the environment, so we cover those
> tools. While other tools may be available, we know the tools we provide
> will be available. Once you know one tool, what it is meant to do and how
> it does it, then the tool you use to perform the task becomes less
> significant. That is, the people that hire you need to know you can do
> those tasks regardless of how you do them.

My post wasn't about third-party defragmenters, but the information provided
in the Training Kit about the built in defragmenter...and how the question
relating to it (which I posted in my original post) is misleading because
the explanation for the answer is wrong.

Please re-read my original post, with the question, and tell me if I'm right
or wrong.
>
> --
> --
> Andy Ruth
> Microsoft Learning
>
> This posting is provided "AS IS" with no warranties, and confers no
> rights.
>
> "Kurt" <> wrote in message
> news:...
>>I think most of us have similar beefs with all exams, MS or otherwise. The
>>questions often seem to deviate from the knowledge base in a way that
>>doesn't help test your knowledge, but seems to deliberately try to confuse
>>the "testee" as to what the question is asking. On a Cisco test one of the
>>questions specified a server's IP address and subnet mask then asked which
>>of the four ip addresses in the answers were in the same subnet.
>>Naturally, I read the question to mean "which of the IP addresses in the
>>answers are in the same subnet as the server?" - otherwise, why include
>>the information about the server's address / mask? The answer was, none of
>>the ip addresses in the questions were in the same subnet as the server.
>>But what the question was asking was, which IP addresses were in the same
>>subnet as EACH OTHER! So the question was not written to test my knowedge
>>of subnetting, but to deceive me into answering incorrectly. MS test
>>questions are no different. On one hand, they need to mix it up so as to
>>prevent "rubber-stamped" answers. But they need to be sure the questions
>>are clear as to what is being asked. I still scored a 92 on the Cisco
>>exam, so it wasn't the one that failed the exam for me, but I wrote in my
>>complaint anyway (I figured out what they were really asking about an hour
>>after I finished the exam).
>>
>> "CJH" <chaselton AT gmail DOT com> wrote in message
>> news:%...
>>>
>>> "CBIC" <> wrote in message
>>> news:...
>>>>
>>>> This is a problem I have with MS tests. They should admit that most
>>>> techs use a third party defragmenting tool like Diskkeeper.
>>>
>>> That won't help. In fact the question specifically refers to Disk
>>> Defragmenter...the Microsoft tool. My beef is with the explanation, and
>>> how it is incorrect and how it throws off the question.
>>>
>>>
>>
>>
>
>

CJH

Sorry, I didn't mean to reply to your concerns directly, just trying to talk
about what we are doing in our exams. For your specific concerns, if the
wording is incorrect on a specific question, you can comment it. We do
review the comments and if there is a question that appears to be incorrect,
we have an expert for that subject matter area review it and either pull the
question from our pool of exam questions or rewrite the question to be
technically correct.

My comments were more to say that we cannot test on tools that do not come
with our product and that we do not try to make questions tricky or a
reading comprehension test.

--
--
Andy Ruth
Microsoft Learning

This posting is provided "AS IS" with no warranties, and confers no
rights.

"CJH" <chaselton AT gmail DOT com> wrote in message
news:%...
>
> "Andy Ruth [MSFT]" <> wrote in message
> news:%...
>> We work hard with the experts that help us create exam items to make sure
>> the questions are relevant and well written. A lot of times, one or two
>> words in the stem (scenario) of the question make an answer right or
>> wrong, so paying close attention is vital.
>>
> Right, but the wording on the explanation on this question is incorrect.
> Did you read my original post?
>
>> For the 3rd party tools, we are measuring what capabilities are available
>> with the product to manage and maintain the environment, so we cover
>> those tools. While other tools may be available, we know the tools we
>> provide will be available. Once you know one tool, what it is meant to do
>> and how it does it, then the tool you use to perform the task becomes
>> less significant. That is, the people that hire you need to know you can
>> do those tasks regardless of how you do them.
>
> My post wasn't about third-party defragmenters, but the information
> provided in the Training Kit about the built in defragmenter...and how the
> question relating to it (which I posted in my original post) is misleading
> because the explanation for the answer is wrong.
>
> Please re-read my original post, with the question, and tell me if I'm
> right or wrong.
>>
>> --
>> --
>> Andy Ruth
>> Microsoft Learning
>>
>> This posting is provided "AS IS" with no warranties, and confers no
>> rights.
>>
>> "Kurt" <> wrote in message
>> news:...
>>>I think most of us have similar beefs with all exams, MS or otherwise.
>>>The questions often seem to deviate from the knowledge base in a way that
>>>doesn't help test your knowledge, but seems to deliberately try to
>>>confuse the "testee" as to what the question is asking. On a Cisco test
>>>one of the questions specified a server's IP address and subnet mask then
>>>asked which of the four ip addresses in the answers were in the same
>>>subnet. Naturally, I read the question to mean "which of the IP addresses
>>>in the answers are in the same subnet as the server?" - otherwise, why
>>>include the information about the server's address / mask? The answer
>>>was, none of the ip addresses in the questions were in the same subnet as
>>>the server. But what the question was asking was, which IP addresses were
>>>in the same subnet as EACH OTHER! So the question was not written to test
>>>my knowedge of subnetting, but to deceive me into answering incorrectly.
>>>MS test questions are no different. On one hand, they need to mix it up
>>>so as to prevent "rubber-stamped" answers. But they need to be sure the
>>>questions are clear as to what is being asked. I still scored a 92 on the
>>>Cisco exam, so it wasn't the one that failed the exam for me, but I wrote
>>>in my complaint anyway (I figured out what they were really asking about
>>>an hour after I finished the exam).
>>>
>>> "CJH" <chaselton AT gmail DOT com> wrote in message
>>> news:%...
>>>>
>>>> "CBIC" <> wrote in message
>>>> news:...
>>>>>
>>>>> This is a problem I have with MS tests. They should admit that most
>>>>> techs use a third party defragmenting tool like Diskkeeper.
>>>>
>>>> That won't help. In fact the question specifically refers to Disk
>>>> Defragmenter...the Microsoft tool. My beef is with the explanation,
>>>> and how it is incorrect and how it throws off the question.
>>>>
>>>>
>>>
>>>
>>
>>
>
>

Andy Ruth [MSFT]

Okay, but can you explain why the practice tests in a training kit that is
supposed to help someone pass the exam are so faulty? I've come across
three so far. One question referred to material that wasn't even covered in
the training kit book! I went back to look up the particular item the
question referred to and only found one mention....and it didn't even
include the information the question asked.

I posted another comment about the same kit....the references in the tests
are all to a book that isn't even included with the kit!

"Andy Ruth [MSFT]" <> wrote in message
news:...
> Sorry, I didn't mean to reply to your concerns directly, just trying to
> talk about what we are doing in our exams. For your specific concerns, if
> the wording is incorrect on a specific question, you can comment it. We do
> review the comments and if there is a question that appears to be
> incorrect, we have an expert for that subject matter area review it and
> either pull the question from our pool of exam questions or rewrite the
> question to be technically correct.
>
> My comments were more to say that we cannot test on tools that do not come
> with our product and that we do not try to make questions tricky or a
> reading comprehension test.
>
> --
> --
> Andy Ruth
> Microsoft Learning
>
> This posting is provided "AS IS" with no warranties, and confers no
> rights.
>
> "CJH" <chaselton AT gmail DOT com> wrote in message
> news:%...
>>
>> "Andy Ruth [MSFT]" <> wrote in message
>> news:%...
>>> We work hard with the experts that help us create exam items to make
>>> sure the questions are relevant and well written. A lot of times, one or
>>> two words in the stem (scenario) of the question make an answer right or
>>> wrong, so paying close attention is vital.
>>>
>> Right, but the wording on the explanation on this question is incorrect.
>> Did you read my original post?
>>
>>> For the 3rd party tools, we are measuring what capabilities are
>>> available with the product to manage and maintain the environment, so we
>>> cover those tools. While other tools may be available, we know the tools
>>> we provide will be available. Once you know one tool, what it is meant
>>> to do and how it does it, then the tool you use to perform the task
>>> becomes less significant. That is, the people that hire you need to know
>>> you can do those tasks regardless of how you do them.
>>
>> My post wasn't about third-party defragmenters, but the information
>> provided in the Training Kit about the built in defragmenter...and how
>> the question relating to it (which I posted in my original post) is
>> misleading because the explanation for the answer is wrong.
>>
>> Please re-read my original post, with the question, and tell me if I'm
>> right or wrong.
>>>
>>> --
>>> --
>>> Andy Ruth
>>> Microsoft Learning
>>>
>>> This posting is provided "AS IS" with no warranties, and confers no
>>> rights.
>>>
>>> "Kurt" <> wrote in message
>>> news:...
>>>>I think most of us have similar beefs with all exams, MS or otherwise.
>>>>The questions often seem to deviate from the knowledge base in a way
>>>>that doesn't help test your knowledge, but seems to deliberately try to
>>>>confuse the "testee" as to what the question is asking. On a Cisco test
>>>>one of the questions specified a server's IP address and subnet mask
>>>>then asked which of the four ip addresses in the answers were in the
>>>>same subnet. Naturally, I read the question to mean "which of the IP
>>>>addresses in the answers are in the same subnet as the server?" -
>>>>otherwise, why include the information about the server's address /
>>>>mask? The answer was, none of the ip addresses in the questions were in
>>>>the same subnet as the server. But what the question was asking was,
>>>>which IP addresses were in the same subnet as EACH OTHER! So the
>>>>question was not written to test my knowedge of subnetting, but to
>>>>deceive me into answering incorrectly. MS test questions are no
>>>>different. On one hand, they need to mix it up so as to prevent
>>>>"rubber-stamped" answers. But they need to be sure the questions are
>>>>clear as to what is being asked. I still scored a 92 on the Cisco exam,
>>>>so it wasn't the one that failed the exam for me, but I wrote in my
>>>>complaint anyway (I figured out what they were really asking about an
>>>>hour after I finished the exam).
>>>>
>>>> "CJH" <chaselton AT gmail DOT com> wrote in message
>>>> news:%...
>>>>>
>>>>> "CBIC" <> wrote in message
>>>>> news:...
>>>>>>
>>>>>> This is a problem I have with MS tests. They should admit that most
>>>>>> techs use a third party defragmenting tool like Diskkeeper.
>>>>>
>>>>> That won't help. In fact the question specifically refers to Disk
>>>>> Defragmenter...the Microsoft tool. My beef is with the explanation,
>>>>> and how it is incorrect and how it throws off the question.
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>
>>>
>>
>>
>
>

CJH