Cheating

Fellas,

I have to agree (as a newly minted MCP) that someone cheating on an exam
does cheapen the cert, but I think the other side of the story is relevant
too, that side being that while a resume full of Microsoft alphabet soup
might get someone in the door for an interview, I can't imagine how any IT
Manager would hire someone who's passed in the manner you describe.

I can tell you from experience that I can pick out someone who knows what
they're talking about in the first 5 minutes. Someone who's used a
braindump only will know terms and definitions, but won't necessarily know
how the whole system works together. Could you imagine discussing AD with
someone who has no experience and just used an exam cram? It'd stick out
like a sore thumb!

Point is, cheaters should be turned in, period. However, that individual
will most likely not be able to discuss most topics and in the end is only
hurting themselves. I'd hire someone who didn't have a ton of experience,
or very little, if they demonstrated initiative and a good understanding of
how to get around th technology.

Rob Cimarolli

In news:e$,
Rob Cimarolli <> rambled:
> Fellas,

Your overall point is well taken, and I agree.

> I have to agree (as a newly minted MCP) that someone cheating on an
> exam does cheapen the cert, but I think the other side of the story
> is relevant too, that side being that while a resume full of
> Microsoft alphabet soup might get someone in the door for an
> interview, I can't imagine how any IT Manager would hire someone
> who's passed in the manner you describe.

However, I disagree that this is the "other side of the story." It's more
the *result* of the cheater's actions. No IT manager wants an MCP, MCSE,
MCASSCLOWN, whatever, anymore. This is because they've been burned, know
someone who's been burned, or just know the state of the certs, and don't
want to take the risk on Mr. Alphabet Soup, when others just like him (hell,
it might even *be* him!) don't know their arse from a hole in the ground
when it comes to computers.

My .02

--

KB - MCNGP "silent thug" #26

Briscobar AT gmail DOT com

www.mcngp.com is too long to fit into a haiku.

Not sure I completely understand what you disagree with...sounds to me like
we're both nodding with each other's points.

Regardless, I think that IT Managers have been burned by cheaters, but also
by exam crams and braindumps. I recently took a course for MCSA/MCDST, and
in this class there were several individuals who were there by their own
admission for the "money". these same folks were the ones talking about
going to a braindump or cram site for the express purpose of passing the
tests. I hate to say it, but these folks were also the weakest students in
the class.

Now, when an IT manager has to sift through these folks in the interview
process, and sees certs in their resumes, I can see why several would
devalue certification over experience. That's a no-brainer. But cheaters
and crammers aside, I still maintain that if you come into an interview with
a positive attitude, are realistic about your experience, show enthusiasm
and a willingness to learn, and show potential, you'll beat out the crammers
and cheaters. Believe me, if you ask a cheater how they'd go about solving
a particular set of problems on the network, and they struggle for a place
to start because they only have soundbites of knowledge, they'll never get
the job.

On the other hand, if you can show that while you maybe haven't performed
that task before, but know enough to work your way through it in a
deliberate fashion, that should give the mgr a bit of a warm fuzzy about
taking a chance on you. I don't know, maybe I'm too much of an optimist.

What has your experience with certification and employability been? Have
the certifications landed you the interview, or what?

"Briscobar" <> wrote in message
news:%...
> In news:e$,
> Rob Cimarolli <> rambled:
>> Fellas,
>
> Your overall point is well taken, and I agree.
>
>> I have to agree (as a newly minted MCP) that someone cheating on an
>> exam does cheapen the cert, but I think the other side of the story
>> is relevant too, that side being that while a resume full of
>> Microsoft alphabet soup might get someone in the door for an
>> interview, I can't imagine how any IT Manager would hire someone
>> who's passed in the manner you describe.
>
> However, I disagree that this is the "other side of the story." It's more
> the *result* of the cheater's actions. No IT manager wants an MCP, MCSE,
> MCASSCLOWN, whatever, anymore. This is because they've been burned, know
> someone who's been burned, or just know the state of the certs, and don't
> want to take the risk on Mr. Alphabet Soup, when others just like him
> (hell,
> it might even *be* him!) don't know their arse from a hole in the ground
> when it comes to computers.
>
> My .02
>
> --
>
> KB - MCNGP "silent thug" #26
>
> Briscobar AT gmail DOT com
>
> www.mcngp.com is too long to fit into a haiku.
>
>

I agree wholeheartedly. It is those who are in it for the money that
normally attempt to just go ahead and defraud ALL of us. Not only
Microsoft.
"Rob Cimarolli" <> wrote in message
news:...
> Not sure I completely understand what you disagree with...sounds to me
> like we're both nodding with each other's points.
>
> Regardless, I think that IT Managers have been burned by cheaters, but
> also by exam crams and braindumps. I recently took a course for
> MCSA/MCDST, and in this class there were several individuals who were
> there by their own admission for the "money". these same folks were the
> ones talking about going to a braindump or cram site for the express
> purpose of passing the tests. I hate to say it, but these folks were also
> the weakest students in the class.
>
> Now, when an IT manager has to sift through these folks in the interview
> process, and sees certs in their resumes, I can see why several would
> devalue certification over experience. That's a no-brainer. But cheaters
> and crammers aside, I still maintain that if you come into an interview
> with a positive attitude, are realistic about your experience, show
> enthusiasm and a willingness to learn, and show potential, you'll beat out
> the crammers and cheaters. Believe me, if you ask a cheater how they'd go
> about solving a particular set of problems on the network, and they
> struggle for a place to start because they only have soundbites of
> knowledge, they'll never get the job.
>
> On the other hand, if you can show that while you maybe haven't performed
> that task before, but know enough to work your way through it in a
> deliberate fashion, that should give the mgr a bit of a warm fuzzy about
> taking a chance on you. I don't know, maybe I'm too much of an optimist.
>
> What has your experience with certification and employability been? Have
> the certifications landed you the interview, or what?
>
> "Briscobar" <> wrote in message
> news:%...
>> In news:e$,
>> Rob Cimarolli <> rambled:
>>> Fellas,
>>
>> Your overall point is well taken, and I agree.
>>
>>> I have to agree (as a newly minted MCP) that someone cheating on an
>>> exam does cheapen the cert, but I think the other side of the story
>>> is relevant too, that side being that while a resume full of
>>> Microsoft alphabet soup might get someone in the door for an
>>> interview, I can't imagine how any IT Manager would hire someone
>>> who's passed in the manner you describe.
>>
>> However, I disagree that this is the "other side of the story." It's more
>> the *result* of the cheater's actions. No IT manager wants an MCP, MCSE,
>> MCASSCLOWN, whatever, anymore. This is because they've been burned, know
>> someone who's been burned, or just know the state of the certs, and don't
>> want to take the risk on Mr. Alphabet Soup, when others just like him
>> (hell,
>> it might even *be* him!) don't know their arse from a hole in the ground
>> when it comes to computers.
>>
>> My .02
>>
>> --
>>
>> KB - MCNGP "silent thug" #26
>>
>> Briscobar AT gmail DOT com
>>
>> www.mcngp.com is too long to fit into a haiku.
>>
>>
>
>

"Nocturnal" <noctATsREMOVEupz.net> wrote in message
>I agree wholeheartedly. It is those who are in it for the money that
>normally attempt to just go ahead and defraud ALL of us. Not only
>Microsoft.

Really? I thought Microsoft was only in it for the money...


--

Liddle Feesh
*fap fap fap fap*
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