EMPIRE STRIKES BACK alteration/fix?

I despise the insertions Lucas spliced into the Cloud City getaway for the 1997
special edition of EMPIRE. Not only is the footage of Vader returning to his
star destroyer unnecessary plot-wise (Vader's original dialogue "bring my
shuttle" always sufficed as far as I'm concerned), but the cutaways wreck the
momentum of John Williams' rousing "Hyperspace" cue.

Since lots of folks aready own the set, will someone please tell me
definitively whether or not the 1997 special edition cutaways of Vader taxiing
back to his ship have been deleted for the 2004 DVD cut (please, oh please!). I
can live with Han and Greedo firing simultaneously -- so long as the garrish
jump cut that resulted from Lucas' incessant tinkering gets smoothed over, that
is (the terrible edit in the 1997 version of ANH is as heinous a cinematic
crime as the political correction of Han's character, IMHO).

This "Hyperspace" scene in ESB also illustrates the ludicrousness of Lucas'
persistent claim that these new versions are his 'preferred' versions, the
visions he was denied the opportunity to realize way back when because of
financial and technological limitations and blah, blah, blah. By his own
ill-justified logic, Lucas was apparently frustrated with ESB in 1980 because
he couldn't yet acquire cutaway footage of the Death Star 2's Commander
greeting Vader in the shuttle bay ... footage that would not be filmed for
three more years for ROTJ ... footage that he would eventually splice into
ESB's Cloud City getaway. Tripe, I say.




"The Han Solo I grew up with would never have let Greedo get the jump on him."

SDamien3

"The Han Solo I grew up with would never have let Greedo get the jump on him."

Umm...I think the guy who INVENTED Han might say otherwise. Get off your damn
high horse.

Yazandtony

"Yazandtony" <> wrote in message
news:...
> "The Han Solo I grew up with would never have let Greedo get the jump on
> him."
>
> Umm...I think the guy who INVENTED Han might say otherwise. Get off your
> damn
> high horse.

The times, they are a-changin'.

Pre-emptive violence is now politically incorrect, especially for bona-fide
Hollywood liberals.

mycroft

On 9/20/04 11:33 AM, in article
HDD3d.7535$ et, "mycroft"
<> wrote:

>
> "Yazandtony" <> wrote in message
> news:...
>> "The Han Solo I grew up with would never have let Greedo get the jump on
>> him."
>>
>> Umm...I think the guy who INVENTED Han might say otherwise. Get off your
>> damn
>> high horse.
>
> The times, they are a-changin'.
>
> Pre-emptive violence is now politically incorrect, especially for bona-fide
> Hollywood liberals.
>
>


Oy. Not this again.

Look, Hollywood movies are positively awash in characters that engage in
"preemptive" violence and conservative types rail against THAT. You can't
really have it both ways. Do the "Hollywood liberals" result in too MUCH
violence or do they water it down?

I don't know what prompted Lucas to make that change but I know this. The
flicks are more or less his to do with as he pleases. If you want the
originals only, there are ways to get copies - on laserdisc or VHS or dubbed
to DVD. There are ways. Would I prefer a nicely restored copy of the OT that
looked as good as this new boxset? Absolutely. Am I annoyed at him for not
releasing same? You bet.

But if he wants to decide that Han wouldn't have shot first, he's free to do
so and make the requisite changes. But he SHOULD preserve the original
versions, as well, as those are the films that made cinema history.

Han SHOULD shoot first. But, oh well.

Neal
--
"If morons could fly, it'd be pitch black." - Anonymous

Video Flyer

Han SHOULD shoot first. But, oh well.

Says....you? Did you write the movie? Direct it? Or are you just a fan who
loves his Star Wars and thinks it's all his?

Yazandtony

*sigh*

SDamien3

"Yazandtony" <> wrote in message
news:...
> Han SHOULD shoot first. But, oh well.
>
> Says....you? Did you write the movie? Direct it? Or are you just a fan
> who
> loves his Star Wars and thinks it's all his?

Did you write the movie? Direct it? Or are you just a fan who loves
George Lucas unconditionally and is unable to think critically or form
his own opinion?

Joshua Zyber

Yazandtony wrote:
> Han SHOULD shoot first. But, oh well.
>
> Says....you? Did you write the movie? Direct it? Or are you just a
> fan who loves his Star Wars and thinks it's all his?

Well call me crazy but Lucas put the film out that way originally. He sure
didn't seem to have that big of a problem with it.

J.S.

On 9/20/04 4:25 PM, in article ,
"Yazandtony" <> wrote:

> Han SHOULD shoot first. But, oh well.
>
> Says....you? Did you write the movie? Direct it? Or are you just a fan who
> loves his Star Wars and thinks it's all his?



Okay, clearly you're just picking fights. One of the points of my post was
that yes I think that Han's shooting first was important in establishing his
character but, hey, it's Lucas' film to do with as he pleases.

Moreover, though, the original Star Wars trilogy was a watershed event in
movie history. These films - taken separately or as a whole - were a
sociological phenomenon. Lucas resuscitated a moribund genre......changed
the way films were made....yada yada yada. To a point, all of the hyperbole
is true. If Mr. Lucas has an appreciation for the history of his art, it
would behoove him NOT to simply jettison the films as they were but to
maintain them alongside any new versions he wants to augment in his search
for perfection. And I wouldn't be at all surprised if, in the end, he didn't
do just that - releasing them in their original form somewhere down the line
and, not coincidentally, raking in even more bucks.

What it comes down to is that Lucas as well as the fans and film historians
out there should all be able to have their cake and eat it, too.

Neal
--
"If morons could fly, it'd be pitch black." - Anonymous

Video Flyer

On 9/20/04 5:20 PM, in article BD74C2C2.1F323%, "Video Flyer"
<> wrote:


> And I wouldn't be at all surprised if, in the end, he didn't
> do just that - releasing them in their original form somewhere down the line
> and, not coincidentally, raking in even more bucks.
>
> Neal



I should have mentioned here that there's an "although" attached, to wit:

ALTHOUGH,......if he DID do this, it would reveal an absolutely unacceptable
level of cynicism and deceit to have created the myth that the originals no
longer existed in the first place. So, perhaps I'm wrong and he really won't
ever release the O-OT.

Neal
--
"If morons could fly, it'd be pitch black." - Anonymous

Video Flyer