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what do i need to write DVDs?

 
 
MR_ED_of_Course
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      11-09-2003
in article 091120030348249309%(E-Mail Removed), Max Volume at
http://www.velocityreviews.com/forums/(E-Mail Removed) wrote on 11/9/03 12:46 AM:

> In article <BBD3227D.26492%(E-Mail Removed)>, MR_ED_of_Course
> <(E-Mail Removed)> wrote:
>
>> I never said you did. Should I have written, "I acknowledge that he did not
>> even write such a script"? What the hell difference does it make, you can
>> write a script, but the region code field would remain the same.

>
> The difference is that if I WROTE the script and included it, I would
> not need to have created a region-encoded DVD-R.


Again, I did not say that you did write the script, but merely acknowledged
that you could. So why are your panties in a bunch?

> However, I have.


No you haven't.

>
>> I've already said numerous times that I don't believe you are correct and
>> Apple, the DVDSP manuals, replicators, and what I've tested myself are
>> wrong. I other words, I don't believe you when you say you received 3
>> different region error messages.

>
> Well that's your ****ing problem.


It's not a problem. You're living in fantasy land and it doesn't affect me
at all.

>> Great, what brand of DVD are you using. Hell, I'll try it. Also, it's not
>> only Apple that is saying it can't be done.

>
> Yes, there's the other ****ing lemmings who believe everything they
> read and don't bother trying anything themselves.


Great except as you know I've said, I've tried this myself. It's one thing
not to believe something read somewhere once, but you are the only person in
the world claiming this.

> I've explained this
> numerous times you stupid moron, but here we go again:
>
> 17" flat-screen iMac -- 800MHz, 256MB RAM, 80GB HD (2002 model)
> Mac OS 10.2.8
> DVD Studio Pro 1.5
> maxell 4.7GB DVD-R 2.0 for General


Numerous times? The question was in regards to the type of media you're
using, which should not make a difference because the region code is in the
VIDEO_TS_IFO file. Writing the project out and then opening the file and
looking at the region code field clearly shows that it is not region coded.
But hey, I'll try the disk since it won't cost me anything extra.

The only post I found in which you stated your media brand was the
10/1/03...which I did not see or reply to...so I guess ONCE is numerous
times.

That was a funny thread. You call DVDhelp and myself idiots and then go on
to suggest that CSS is not available for obvious reasons, but it does seem
possible to you that Macrovision is. WOW, what an retarded asshole you've
become.

Go ahead and report back that you can circumvent Macrovision licensing fees
using DVDSP. I really hope you do, because you'll be just that much more
unbelievable.

>> Your comments earlier were pretty negative about it. Besides the timeline
>> is not just a video editor in DVDSP, as such, it certainly isn't a required
>> feature, but it makes lining up multichannel audio tracks, angles, and so
>> forth a bit easier rather than going back into FCP. Especially with the
>> improvements in DVDSP2 in regards to having variable length angles.

>
> Variable-length angles is a good feature to have, but you're still
> missing the pretty ****ing basic point that DVDs are NOT LINEAR!!!
> It's a random-access medium, so not every project is going to fit
> nicely onto a ****ing linear timeline! Think outside the box for once
> and realize that not everyone creates DVDs that are just movies!!!


I like the last line. It's you who are thinking very narrow mindedly once
again. I never said that the timeline is a crucial part of every project in
DVDSP2. In many cases the author would never bring up a timeline. The fact
that DVD's are not linear is a great argument if you're a retard and that's
the only true thing you're capable of saying about DVDs, but components of
DVD may in fact be easier to edit on a timeline because they are linear.

It's precisely when you have a DVD that isn't just a movie that you may want
to use the timeline. Again, I think you just don't know what you're talking
about and as a result you're saying stupid things about software you've
never used.

>> Existing templates has nothing to do with either situation. DVDSP2 comes
>> with only a handful of sample templates. Certainly, it's easy to see how
>> templates wouldn't be used, but like Filemaker, sometimes it makes sense to
>> set up templates for someone else being hired to do simple data entry...or
>> video entry.

>
> Regardless, it's all cookie-cutter crap, whether you create the
> cookie-cutter from scratch or not. It's pointless, and "professionals"
> don't bother using such pedestrian features.


That's not true at all. I've already seen several studios and worked with
several people who are using DVDSP to process video projects where the
templates are created by a graphics department and handed to the video
department (usually the FCP editors) for authoring.

Again, not Harry Potter, but instances where branding, functionality and so
forth result in templates being the most efficient way of dealing with the
production...by professionals.

>> It doesn't mater what you're doing. In fact it's exactly what you aren't
>> doing. You accuse me of being narrow minded or ignorant, but it's just the
>> opposite. I never once said that templates are for everyone pro or
>> otherwise, only that it was a smart idea for Apple to include this
>> functionality in DVDSP2 and that it will be used by pros and consumers.

>
> My point is, moron, that DVD Studio (let me spell it out for you) PEE
> ARR ****ing OHHHH is supposed to be a PROfessional package! Leave the
> templates to cute little iDVD!!!


****ing idiot, tell us how to use angles, DD 5.1, language tracks, subtitles
or any of the other higher end features in iDVD. You can't. These features
as well as others are part of what's different between iDVD and DVDSP. Just
because in *your* very specific narrow niche use of the product you see no
need for templates (and that's fine) doesn't mean that others should be
forced to use iDVD, and never use these other features.

>
>> Great, Harry Potter has a nice menu. Great, you did the whole thing
>> yourself, or some other project just as spectacular. You're not the only
>> professional, and what you do is not the only task or mission of a
>> professional using DVDSP. From the beginning, I've stated that there are
>> many reasons why Apple included templates, and your claim was that it was
>> stupid and people should just use iDVD if they want to use templates. Admit
>> it, there are reasons why professionals would want to use templates. This
>> is a feature not related to your limited (however spectacular) use of DVDSP,
>> but for many such as the OP or some studios...in particular one of the
>> studios I worked at where we would've loved to have had the ability create
>> templates for the various shows.

>
> That is total crap. By their very nature, templates are generic. I
> can use the same Photoshop file, and it'll contain all the same
> buttons, etc. that a template would. A little editing is all that's
> required to create yet another bland, boring piece of ****. If that's
> all you're concerned about, stick with iDVD.


Again, very narrow minded. A department who's work flow would be more
efficient with templates should sacrifice all the other features of DVDSP
and use iDVD?

Why keep all the assets in Photoshop, when it *is* easier to have them
already to go in DVDSP?

>> Even beyond the need for template looking and functioning disks, there is
>> the ability to template any component of a project. In other words the end
>> user would never know that the template from one DVD was used for another,
>> but the person who did the authoring may have save a lot of time by simply
>> replacing the needed components rather than starting from scratch. This of
>> course is not Harry Potter, but than again not all DVDs being produced fall
>> into the Harry Potter category.

>
> Not all DVDs produced fit into the "The Day My Wife Popped Out Our
> Third Kid" category, either.


No, but your argument all along has been very narrow minded and presumptive
of Harry Potter type DVD production. My argument isn't that there nobody
exists like you who doesn't need templates, but merely templates can be used
by a variety of people in a variety of situations. This can be for workflow
amongst departments, or production of similarly branded and functional
titles, and so on. Your argument is basically, those people either don't
exist, or don't ever require any features beyond iDVD. That's simply not
true.

>> Now that you see how some people have a need for templates, or at least how
>> templates can facilitate production...what software would *you* recommend
>> for anyone who wanted template functionality, but also wanted DD 5.1,
>> angles, subtitles, language tracks, output to DLT or CMF, etc...?

>
> You're contradicting yourself. That's basically asking "what software
> would someone use if they're a beginner creating a DVD of home movies,
> but want their camcorder footage to be heard in full 5.1 surround?"
> You obviously have no ****ing clue what the difference is between
> professional DVD authoring and "making a DVD", so why the **** should I
> bother explaining it to you???


No, that's not what I said at all. Try answering the question instead of
being such a chicken ****.

The OP of this thread has a particular situation where it *may* in fact be
beneficial to have templates and advanced features. So for example he might
want subtitles to display text from what the scenes are from in the reel.
He might want to add a language track where you could choose between
listening to the scene by itself or commentary from the actor about the
scene. Perhaps angles for animation scenes showing the animation versus the
actor reading.

Suppose these are all things the OP wants to do. Now suppose the OP does
not know Photoshop, or is not very artistic. Perhaps he knows how to edit
video and maybe edit some graphic titles and such, but that's it.

If the OP wants to have someone come in, set up a system, create a wide
variety of templates where he could simply drag and drop the necessary
elements and have the app build the project, what software would you
recommend?

I would recommend DVDSP2.

You would tell him to either learn Photoshop and do everything himself, or
forget about a lot of what you want and use iDVD. You would also tell him
that if he learns Photoshop, he still should recreate each project from
scratch, even though it would be a lot easier simply to select the template
he wanted with DVDSP2.

Your narrow mind can't grasp that someone would want features beyond iDVD,
but would also want templates...either other people's templates or the
ability to save those that they create themselves.

Thank God Apple doesn't share your narrow view of the world.

 
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MR_ED_of_Course
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Posts: n/a
 
      11-09-2003
in article 091120030356489537%(E-Mail Removed), Max Volume at
(E-Mail Removed) wrote on 11/9/03 12:54 AM:

> In article <BBD3227D.26492%(E-Mail Removed)>, MR_ED_of_Course
> <(E-Mail Removed)> wrote:
>
>> not all DVDs being produced fall
>> into the Harry Potter category.

>
> Oh, and one more thing. You ****ing infuriate me with your outright
> refusal to rub a couple of brain cells together and think about what
> you're ****ing reading!!! My point, genius, was that there are SO many
> ****ing differences between two PROFESSIONAL DVD MENUS that templates
> would do no ****ing good whatsoever. **** Harry Potter, just go rent
> two ****ing DVDs that aren't produced by Madacy and tell me how a
> template from the first disc could be used to produce the menu for the
> second.
>
> Have you got it NOW, you tiny-brained imbecile???


Talk about using brain cells to read...dude, did I say that not all DVDs are
Harry Potter....no I said they did not all fall into that category. As in
of course a Harry Potter template would do no good in producing the Matrix 3
DVD.

Again, you're the one being narrow minded. I acknowledge that the producers
of the Harry Potter DVD probably had no thought at all about using
templates. And I don't see how they could.

I doubt that any top DVD at Blockbuster or whatever would be something that
I would see as having a need for templates by those producers.

Great, but...

All along I've been talking about how there are people who need different
features in DVDSP for their particular professional needs.

So go to a studio that is cranking out DVDs all day and has a need for
templates to make the process the most efficient, and for consistency in
functionality and branding, and you'll realize the world that exists outside
of your narrow niche. Specifically if that niche is one where you're only
looking at major movie releases as opposed to TV studios, ad agencies, pr
agencies, or as in the case of the OP talent agencies.

It's not a problem of me not understanding your use of DVDSP. I
acknowledged that from the beginning. It's *you* who are saying that if
people aren't using DVDSP the way you are, then **** them when it comes to
DVDSP features, they should be using iDVD.

The TV studio I worked in had a specific use of features requiring DVDSP
instead of iDVD. The disks we were cranking out daily had to maintain
consistency in branding and functionality. It was a perfect situation for
using templates created by our graphics team.

 
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Colon Terminus
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Posts: n/a
 
      11-09-2003
Hi Max,

Oh. Why didn't you say so in the first place? You could've saved yourself a lot of frustration.

By the way. You've hurt my feelings, yelling at me like that. I will get over it, but for now, I'm really hurt.

Why would you do such an unfeeling that as that?

Please don't yell at me again, but I just have to ask. How would the original poster go about copying clips from commercial DVDs to
include in his artists showcase video if he didn't have, or use, some mechanism to defeat Macrovision?

"Max Volume" <(E-Mail Removed)> wrote in message news:091120030046375356%(E-Mail Removed) m...
> In article <k6krb.659082$(E-Mail Removed)>, Colon Terminus
> <(E-Mail Removed)> wrote:
>
> > The guy was on a budget, he couldn't afford alienware.

>
> Oh, for pete's sake -- ALL I'M SAYING HERE IS DON'T EVEN *START*
> TALKING ABOUT "PROFESSIONAL WORKSTATIONS" THEN LIST A BUNCH OF CONSUMER
> CRAP, *E*S*P*E*C*I*A*L*L*Y* NOT A ****ING MACRO BUSTER!!!!!!!!!!!!



 
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Frode
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Posts: n/a
 
      11-09-2003
-----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE-----
Hash: SHA1

Colon Terminus wrote:
>Please don't yell at me again, but I just have to ask. How would the
>original poster go about copying clips from commercial DVDs to include in
>his artists showcase video if he didn't have, or use, some mechanism to
>defeat Macrovision?


The OP said "Anyway, we have been doing these on video tape up to this
point". In other words either the source material is not macrovisioned, or
he already has a way to bypass it.

If macrovisioned, and the "fix" is an analog box between the playback and
recording device, it won't be very useful for DVDs but that's not an issue
when it comes to DVD ripping anyways so he should be in the clear.

Either way it's irrelevant to the OP's question about a fairly decent
hardware setup to capture/edit short video clips.


- --
Frode

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Max Volume
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      11-10-2003
In article <BBD3509E.264C3%(E-Mail Removed)>, MR_ED_of_Course
<(E-Mail Removed)> wrote:

> No you haven't.


I know you are but what am I?

> It's not a problem. You're living in fantasy land and it doesn't affect me
> at all.


You know, that's just sad. Fine, burn region-free discs, I don't care.

> Great except as you know I've said, I've tried this myself. It's one thing
> not to believe something read somewhere once, but you are the only person in
> the world claiming this.


So automatically I'm wrong? Nice logic there.

> Numerous times? The question was in regards to the type of media you're
> using, which should not make a difference because the region code is in the
> VIDEO_TS_IFO file. Writing the project out and then opening the file and
> looking at the region code field clearly shows that it is not region coded.
> But hey, I'll try the disk since it won't cost me anything extra.


Do that.

> The only post I found in which you stated your media brand was the
> 10/1/03...which I did not see or reply to...so I guess ONCE is numerous
> times.


I *have* mentioned this numerous times but was ignored. Now all of a
sudden you want to know. Well, **** you.

> That was a funny thread. You call DVDhelp and myself idiots and then go on
> to suggest that CSS is not available for obvious reasons, but it does seem
> possible to you that Macrovision is. WOW, what an retarded asshole you've
> become.


I have found that Macrovision is NOT supported by my drive. Happy now?

> Go ahead and report back that you can circumvent Macrovision licensing fees
> using DVDSP. I really hope you do, because you'll be just that much more
> unbelievable.


Read the above line, moron. If something's not possible, I say so. If
it is possible, I say so. Should I just acknowledge the possibility of
things YOU think will work???

> I like the last line. It's you who are thinking very narrow mindedly once
> again. I never said that the timeline is a crucial part of every project in
> DVDSP2. In many cases the author would never bring up a timeline. The fact
> that DVD's are not linear is a great argument if you're a retard and that's
> the only true thing you're capable of saying about DVDs, but components of
> DVD may in fact be easier to edit on a timeline because they are linear.


Dude. Learn what random-access means then get back to me.

> It's precisely when you have a DVD that isn't just a movie that you may want
> to use the timeline.


Oh, I GOTTA HEAR THIS!!! How exactly is a timeline going to HELP with
a non-linear DVD??? I'm waiting...

> Again, I think you just don't know what you're talking
> about and as a result you're saying stupid things about software you've
> never used.


I know enough about DVDs to know that a timeline is just going to get
in the way.

> That's not true at all. I've already seen several studios and worked with
> several people who are using DVDSP to process video projects where the
> templates are created by a graphics department and handed to the video
> department (usually the FCP editors) for authoring.


Name them.

> Again, not Harry Potter, but instances where branding, functionality and so
> forth result in templates being the most efficient way of dealing with the
> production...by professionals.


People who are paid to create this crap, maybe. I'm not using the term
in its absolute broadest definition like you are.

> ****ing idiot, tell us how to use angles, DD 5.1, language tracks, subtitles
> or any of the other higher end features in iDVD. You can't. These features
> as well as others are part of what's different between iDVD and DVDSP. Just
> because in *your* very specific narrow niche use of the product you see no
> need for templates (and that's fine) doesn't mean that others should be
> forced to use iDVD, and never use these other features.


If someone needs advanced features, they should be quite capable of
creating their own menus. Is that so difficult to grasp???

> Again, very narrow minded. A department who's work flow would be more
> efficient with templates should sacrifice all the other features of DVDSP
> and use iDVD?


Again, if you are Joe Six-Pack making a DVD of you and your old lady
****ing, you don't NEED the advanced features.

> Why keep all the assets in Photoshop, when it *is* easier to have them
> already to go in DVDSP?


Photoshop files ARE ready to go into DVD Studio Pro!!!

> No, but your argument all along has been very narrow minded and presumptive
> of Harry Potter type DVD production. My argument isn't that there nobody
> exists like you who doesn't need templates, but merely templates can be used
> by a variety of people in a variety of situations. This can be for workflow
> amongst departments, or production of similarly branded and functional
> titles, and so on. Your argument is basically, those people either don't
> exist, or don't ever require any features beyond iDVD. That's simply not
> true.


Keep thinking that. Simply put, a creative individual who doesn't want
to create cookie-cutter DVDs has no use for templates. Period.

> No, that's not what I said at all. Try answering the question instead of
> being such a chicken ****.


The answer to your ****ing question, you waste of food, is that there
doesn't NEED to be software bridging that gap!!! The ****ing amateurs
can use iDVD and don't NEED AC3, multiple angles and audio streams,
etc. and the PROS don't need templates!!!!!

> The OP of this thread has a particular situation where it *may* in fact be
> beneficial to have templates and advanced features. So for example he might
> want subtitles to display text from what the scenes are from in the reel.
> He might want to add a language track where you could choose between
> listening to the scene by itself or commentary from the actor about the
> scene. Perhaps angles for animation scenes showing the animation versus the
> actor reading.


Then he needs to learn to create his own ****ing menus. Really, it's
not that difficult.

> Suppose these are all things the OP wants to do. Now suppose the OP does
> not know Photoshop, or is not very artistic. Perhaps he knows how to edit
> video and maybe edit some graphic titles and such, but that's it.


Then how the **** is he going to author advanced features like multiple
angles??? Your argument is full of holes.

> If the OP wants to have someone come in, set up a system, create a wide
> variety of templates where he could simply drag and drop the necessary
> elements and have the app build the project, what software would you
> recommend?


It's a fallacial argument.

> I would recommend DVDSP2.


You're an idiot.

> You would tell him to either learn Photoshop and do everything himself, or
> forget about a lot of what you want and use iDVD. You would also tell him
> that if he learns Photoshop, he still should recreate each project from
> scratch, even though it would be a lot easier simply to select the template
> he wanted with DVDSP2.


He can simply change the Photoshop document, it doesn't matter. This
whole argument is based on some non-creative schlub wanting a purty
Hollywood DVD, and it just ain't gonna happen. Try to hire someone to
create DVDSP 2 templates for you to finish off, and he's gonna laugh at
you.

> Your narrow mind can't grasp that someone would want features beyond iDVD,
> but would also want templates...either other people's templates or the
> ability to save those that they create themselves.


It's not narrow-minded at all. It's called separating the men from the
boys.

> Thank God Apple doesn't share your narrow view of the world.


Apple is profit-driven. If they can show rank amateurs how easy DVDSP
2 is to use, they'll drop the cash rather than stick with iDVD. Apple
doesn't care if they can actually DRIVE the car, they just want to make
the sale.
 
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Max Volume
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Posts: n/a
 
      11-10-2003
In article <BBD35449.264C7%(E-Mail Removed)>, MR_ED_of_Course
<(E-Mail Removed)> wrote:

> The TV studio I worked in had a specific use of features requiring DVDSP
> instead of iDVD. The disks we were cranking out daily had to maintain
> consistency in branding and functionality. It was a perfect situation for
> using templates created by our graphics team.


Well, there's the underlying problem. What if Warner Bros. decided
that "branding", as you call it, was a GOOD thing??? You'd see EVERY
WB release using the SAME layout. Look up creative in the dictionary,
asshole... I don't think it says anything about "branding".
 
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Max Volume
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      11-10-2003
In article <fyurb.45472$(E-Mail Removed)>, Colon Terminus
<(E-Mail Removed)> wrote:

> Please don't yell at me again, but I just have to ask. How would the original
> poster go about copying clips from commercial DVDs to
> include in his artists showcase video if he didn't have, or use, some
> mechanism to defeat Macrovision?


Let me clarify...


"professional workstation" = TBC

"home hobby setup" = macro buster


"Don't bother with a home hobby setup, get a macro buster" = STUPID!!!!!


Get it now, you ****ing retard????
 
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MR_ED_of_Course
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      11-10-2003

>> Great except as you know I've said, I've tried this myself. It's one thing
>> not to believe something read somewhere once, but you are the only person in
>> the world claiming this.

>
> So automatically I'm wrong? Nice logic there.


No, once again...after getting the information from Apple, from the manuals,
from replicators and others, as well as testing it for myself, I'm weighing
all of this versus one person who is a total obnoxious asshole from hell who
claims somehow he can do this, where the rest of the world can not.

I was convinced a long time ago that you're a total ass who would never
admit they're wrong and would rather lie, insult, and argue.

This is why you made totally retarded comments about iDVD3 only to later
admit that you never used it. This is why you've also made retarded
comments about DVDSP2 and refuse to accept that you were wrong about
statements you made before you had even seen the software.

>> The only post I found in which you stated your media brand was the
>> 10/1/03...which I did not see or reply to...so I guess ONCE is numerous
>> times.

>
> I *have* mentioned this numerous times but was ignored. Now all of a
> sudden you want to know. Well, **** you.


Where did you mention the media in a post where I responded? I searched on
Google and only found one posting where you mentioned the media. You
mentioned the Mac, the version of DVDSP, but only once did it show you
mentioned the media, and this was in a thread that transpired when I was on
vacation.

Nice of you to ignore how the media would not matter...couldn't come up with
an excuse eh?

>> That was a funny thread. You call DVDhelp and myself idiots and then go on
>> to suggest that CSS is not available for obvious reasons, but it does seem
>> possible to you that Macrovision is. WOW, what an retarded asshole you've
>> become.

>
> I have found that Macrovision is NOT supported by my drive. Happy now?


No, it's not supported by DVDSP. The drive has nothing to do with it. Save
it out to your hard drive and then check the Macrovision flags. Guess what?
Macrovision is only supported in DVDSP as CMF and DLT to be sent to
replicators...sounds a bit like region coding doesn't it?

>> Go ahead and report back that you can circumvent Macrovision licensing fees
>> using DVDSP. I really hope you do, because you'll be just that much more
>> unbelievable.

>
> Read the above line, moron. If something's not possible, I say so. If
> it is possible, I say so. Should I just acknowledge the possibility of
> things YOU think will work???


Your posting implied that DVDhelp.com, Apple myself and others were talking
**** about what could be done. You offered your theory of Macrovision as
one more thing we were wrong about. The reality is that you were wrong
about Macrovision and you've been lying about region coding or are just to
stupid to realize that you didn't burn a region coded disk with DVDSP.

>> I like the last line. It's you who are thinking very narrow mindedly once
>> again. I never said that the timeline is a crucial part of every project in
>> DVDSP2. In many cases the author would never bring up a timeline. The fact
>> that DVD's are not linear is a great argument if you're a retard and that's
>> the only true thing you're capable of saying about DVDs, but components of
>> DVD may in fact be easier to edit on a timeline because they are linear.

>
> Dude. Learn what random-access means then get back to me.


Dude, you have no idea what the **** you are talking about and it continues
to show. You constantly argue the stupidest points that are not only
contrary to what I'm saying but go against all the reasons why features like
the timeline were implemented and what the reviewers have to say about it.

You've posted comments that demonstrate that you've either never seen the
timeline or simply don't understand how it works.

>> It's precisely when you have a DVD that isn't just a movie that you may want
>> to use the timeline.

>
> Oh, I GOTTA HEAR THIS!!! How exactly is a timeline going to HELP with
> a non-linear DVD??? I'm waiting...


This is a great example. I said that the timeline would be more useful when
it isn't just a movie. I didn't say it would help with a non-linear DVD.
More importantly, I didn't say it would help at all with the non-linear
construction of the DVD.

Instead of being such an obnoxious jerk-off, why don't you go to an Apple
store and take a look at timeline yourself. If you're not a retard, you'll
see the reasons why people asked for it, Apple implemented it, other apps
have implemented a similar feature, and why reviewers have expressed
appreciation for it.

>> Again, I think you just don't know what you're talking
>> about and as a result you're saying stupid things about software you've
>> never used.

>
> I know enough about DVDs to know that a timeline is just going to get
> in the way.


But you don't know enough about what the hell you're talking about. The
timeline does *not* get in the way, and it's the type of statement I would
expect from someone who has never used the software but wants to talk ****.

>> That's not true at all. I've already seen several studios and worked with
>> several people who are using DVDSP to process video projects where the
>> templates are created by a graphics department and handed to the video
>> department (usually the FCP editors) for authoring.

>
> Name them.


No.

Normally I would, but in almost every post I've seen by you, you've come
across as a totally rude obnoxious asshole. Those who know me here know
where I've worked, what I've done, and who I know. The last thing I want to
do is subject the names of companies here for you to post retarded comments
about them.

>> ****ing idiot, tell us how to use angles, DD 5.1, language tracks, subtitles
>> or any of the other higher end features in iDVD. You can't. These features
>> as well as others are part of what's different between iDVD and DVDSP. Just
>> because in *your* very specific narrow niche use of the product you see no
>> need for templates (and that's fine) doesn't mean that others should be
>> forced to use iDVD, and never use these other features.

>
> If someone needs advanced features, they should be quite capable of
> creating their own menus. Is that so difficult to grasp???


You're totally wrong. How many people created the Harry Potter DVD? Was it
one person who did the whole thing, or was it a team?

Most movie studio DVDs are created by a team. Set aside the actual video,
the production of a DVD is usually based on experts who know graphics,
animation, audio, interactive design and so forth.

It totally makes sense, and I've been in environments where there have been
people who could create really nice menus with Photoshop, After Effects, and
then turn the templates over to people who were FCP experts and knew enough
of DVDSP to finish production.

You are too narrow minded to see that there are situations in between the
functionality of iDVD and being able to produce the Harry Potter DVD all by
yourself.


>> Again, very narrow minded. A department who's work flow would be more
>> efficient with templates should sacrifice all the other features of DVDSP
>> and use iDVD?

>
> Again, if you are Joe Six-Pack making a DVD of you and your old lady
> ****ing, you don't NEED the advanced features.


So you'd deny Joe the ability to do multi-angles showing him and his old
lady? This is incredibly easy to do with DVDSP2 using the timeline, but
apparently unless Joe knows Photoshop, he must use iDVD in your world.

Again, this isn't just about Joe S. Pack, this is also about all the other
reasons why templates functionality was added to DVDSP2.

>> Why keep all the assets in Photoshop, when it *is* easier to have them
>> already to go in DVDSP?

>
> Photoshop files ARE ready to go into DVD Studio Pro!!!


Yes, but it is *easier* to deal with templates which may already have
everything ready to go for a particular project...not just the graphic
elements for the menus from Photoshop. Why deal with importing from
PhotoShop, AfterEffects, etc, and deal with setting everything up from
scratch when you want to create a DVD that will have the same branding,
functionality and so on as previous DVDs you've already produced from
scratch?

>> No, but your argument all along has been very narrow minded and presumptive
>> of Harry Potter type DVD production. My argument isn't that there nobody
>> exists like you who doesn't need templates, but merely templates can be used
>> by a variety of people in a variety of situations. This can be for workflow
>> amongst departments, or production of similarly branded and functional
>> titles, and so on. Your argument is basically, those people either don't
>> exist, or don't ever require any features beyond iDVD. That's simply not
>> true.

>
> Keep thinking that. Simply put, a creative individual who doesn't want
> to create cookie-cutter DVDs has no use for templates. Period.


Creativity has nothing to do with it. A person who doesn't have a need to
create DVDs with consistent branding, functionality, graphics, look, feel,
etc... has no need for templates. One more time, I'll say that templates
are not for everyone. But for a variety of people, including professionals,
there are numerous uses for templates given a certain set of circumstances.

>> No, that's not what I said at all. Try answering the question instead of
>> being such a chicken ****.

>
> The answer to your ****ing question, you waste of food, is that there
> doesn't NEED to be software bridging that gap!!! The ****ing amateurs
> can use iDVD and don't NEED AC3, multiple angles and audio streams,
> etc. and the PROS don't need templates!!!!!


Again, this is where you're just being narrow minded. You're being narrow
minded because:
1) You think that the only reason why someone would want a template is if
they are not creative enough to do their own menus.

2) If you know how to create more than 1 video you should know how and be
creative enough to use Photoshop. If you know how to create more than 2
channels of sound you should know how and be creative enough to use
Photoshop. If you know how to type (and thus create subtitles) you should
know how and be creative enough to use Photoshop. The list goes one for all
of the features that DVDSP has over iDVD.

>> The OP of this thread has a particular situation where it *may* in fact be
>> beneficial to have templates and advanced features. So for example he might
>> want subtitles to display text from what the scenes are from in the reel.
>> He might want to add a language track where you could choose between
>> listening to the scene by itself or commentary from the actor about the
>> scene. Perhaps angles for animation scenes showing the animation versus the
>> actor reading.

>
> Then he needs to learn to create his own ****ing menus. Really, it's
> not that difficult.


It's not that hard to be a professional graphic and animation designer?
Again, you're too narrow minded and/or too obstinate to even acknowledge
these situations exist.

>
>> Suppose these are all things the OP wants to do. Now suppose the OP does
>> not know Photoshop, or is not very artistic. Perhaps he knows how to edit
>> video and maybe edit some graphic titles and such, but that's it.

>
> Then how the **** is he going to author advanced features like multiple
> angles??? Your argument is full of holes.


With DVDSP2, all the OP would need to do is get two video tracks. They
don't even have to be the same length in DVDSP2. He selects the template
that was made for him, and drags the videos into the dropzones. He can pull
up the timeline and adjust the angles if he wants, and then build the
project.

VERY EASY.


>> If the OP wants to have someone come in, set up a system, create a wide
>> variety of templates where he could simply drag and drop the necessary
>> elements and have the app build the project, what software would you
>> recommend?

>
> It's a fallacial argument.


The word you're looking for is fallacious. The word you used sounds like
what happens when someone slips during a Bukkake. (sorry, I normally don't
correct typos or whatever in postings, but this time I couldn't resist
because I thought it was too funny).

No it's not. It sounds very much like something the OP might be interested
in, and if not there are others who have created a market for templates.

>
>> You would tell him to either learn Photoshop and do everything himself, or
>> forget about a lot of what you want and use iDVD. You would also tell him
>> that if he learns Photoshop, he still should recreate each project from
>> scratch, even though it would be a lot easier simply to select the template
>> he wanted with DVDSP2.

>
> He can simply change the Photoshop document, it doesn't matter.


Yes, it does. Use DVDSP2 and the templates and see for yourself. You
wonder why I don't believe you're the only person in the world who can burn
region coded DVDs with DVDSP, and it's comments like this where you're
talking about **** you know nothing about.

> This
> whole argument is based on some non-creative schlub wanting a purty
> Hollywood DVD, and it just ain't gonna happen. Try to hire someone to
> create DVDSP 2 templates for you to finish off, and he's gonna laugh at
> you.


No not Hollywood DVDs. How many times must I say that? You're being way to
narrow minded when you focus on that. There are all types of jobs out there
in the corporate world where for many reasons the Harry Potter menu is not
what is wanted.

>> Thank God Apple doesn't share your narrow view of the world.

>
> Apple is profit-driven. If they can show rank amateurs how easy DVDSP
> 2 is to use, they'll drop the cash rather than stick with iDVD. Apple
> doesn't care if they can actually DRIVE the car, they just want to make
> the sale.


You do realize that DVDSP2 does not come with a suite of templates right?
So it's not like as if they're showing it off only in terms of using the
templates. Furthermore, you're supporting my argument here. If Apple can
show DVDSP2 as being easy (comparable to iDVD) then why would someone buy
it? They would only buy it if it allowed them to do some of the additional
features not possible in iDVD.

 
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Max Volume
Guest
Posts: n/a
 
      11-10-2003
In article <BBD43860.2662C%(E-Mail Removed)>, MR_ED_of_Course
<(E-Mail Removed)> wrote:

> No, once again...after getting the information from Apple, from the manuals,
> from replicators and others, as well as testing it for myself, I'm weighing
> all of this versus one person who is a total obnoxious asshole from hell who
> claims somehow he can do this, where the rest of the world can not.


I never said the rest of the world couldn't, you piece of ****.

> I was convinced a long time ago that you're a total ass who would never
> admit they're wrong and would rather lie, insult, and argue.


And I mentioned that Macrovision was not possible WHY?????

> This is why you made totally retarded comments about iDVD3 only to later
> admit that you never used it. This is why you've also made retarded
> comments about DVDSP2 and refuse to accept that you were wrong about
> statements you made before you had even seen the software.


Listen -- I don't need to USE version 2 to know that a timeline only
gets in the way of a NON-LINEAR product, and that templates are
USELESS!

> Where did you mention the media in a post where I responded?


You really like to narrow your argument when you're proven wrong, don't
you? If I conclusively proved to you that I created a region-coded DVD
on three specific dates, and they were a Wednesday, a Friday, and a
Sunday, would you again shift your argument to say that it is
impossible to create a region-coded DVD-R on a Thursday???

> Nice of you to ignore how the media would not matter...couldn't come up with
> an excuse eh?


What the **** are you talking about??? I am totally open to the idea
that high-quality media supports region coding but cheap Princo ****
doesn't! Why the **** do you think I've been so specific??? Your
claims that DVD-R media does not support region coding PERIOD leave a
lot up to assumption.

> No, it's not supported by DVDSP. The drive has nothing to do with it. Save
> it out to your hard drive and then check the Macrovision flags. Guess what?
> Macrovision is only supported in DVDSP as CMF and DLT to be sent to
> replicators...sounds a bit like region coding doesn't it?


You're a ****ing idiot. DVD Studio Pro DOES support Macrovision!!!
The DRIVE is not able to set the flags, NOT the software!!!

> Your posting implied that DVDhelp.com, Apple myself and others were talking
> **** about what could be done. You offered your theory of Macrovision as
> one more thing we were wrong about. The reality is that you were wrong
> about Macrovision and you've been lying about region coding or are just to
> stupid to realize that you didn't burn a region coded disk with DVDSP.


No, it's you who are too stupid to realize that just because you read
something in a manual it doesn't make it so.

> Dude, you have no idea what the **** you are talking about and it continues
> to show. You constantly argue the stupidest points that are not only
> contrary to what I'm saying but go against all the reasons why features like
> the timeline were implemented and what the reviewers have to say about it.


I'm stil waiting...

> You've posted comments that demonstrate that you've either never seen the
> timeline or simply don't understand how it works.


I understand it perfectly. YOU don't seem to know that DVDs are
non-linear. Still waiting...

> This is a great example. I said that the timeline would be more useful when
> it isn't just a movie. I didn't say it would help with a non-linear DVD.
> More importantly, I didn't say it would help at all with the non-linear
> construction of the DVD.


Then in what way is it useful for a non-linear format such as DVD. My
comment that not all DVDs were just movies meant that it is not a
linear format... clear enough???

> Instead of being such an obnoxious jerk-off, why don't you go to an Apple
> store and take a look at timeline yourself. If you're not a retard, you'll
> see the reasons why people asked for it, Apple implemented it, other apps
> have implemented a similar feature, and why reviewers have expressed
> appreciation for it.


DVD is a non-linear format. I'm still waiting for your argument to the
contrary...

> But you don't know enough about what the hell you're talking about. The
> timeline does *not* get in the way, and it's the type of statement I would
> expect from someone who has never used the software but wants to talk ****.


You have yet to explain how it helps, so I can only assume otherwise...

> No.
>
> Normally I would, but in almost every post I've seen by you, you've come
> across as a totally rude obnoxious asshole. Those who know me here know
> where I've worked, what I've done, and who I know. The last thing I want to
> do is subject the names of companies here for you to post retarded comments
> about them.


Nice excuse. Stay in your basement, moron.

> You're totally wrong. How many people created the Harry Potter DVD? Was it
> one person who did the whole thing, or was it a team?


Dude, this guy is not talking about starting a TEAM, so don't even give
me that crap.

> Most movie studio DVDs are created by a team. Set aside the actual video,
> the production of a DVD is usually based on experts who know graphics,
> animation, audio, interactive design and so forth.
>
> It totally makes sense, and I've been in environments where there have been
> people who could create really nice menus with Photoshop, After Effects, and
> then turn the templates over to people who were FCP experts and knew enough
> of DVDSP to finish production.
>
> You are too narrow minded to see that there are situations in between the
> functionality of iDVD and being able to produce the Harry Potter DVD all by
> yourself.


Dude, regardless of how many people are involved, templates are
useless. What the **** are they going to re-use the template for? The
sequel??? Yeah, that'd go over well. Talk to me when you've authored
a DVD.

> So you'd deny Joe the ability to do multi-angles showing him and his old
> lady? This is incredibly easy to do with DVDSP2 using the timeline, but
> apparently unless Joe knows Photoshop, he must use iDVD in your world.


If Joe can't figure out Photoshop, how the **** is he gonna author
multiple angles? You moronic ****ing idiot.

> Again, this isn't just about Joe S. Pack, this is also about all the other
> reasons why templates functionality was added to DVDSP2.


To lure naive amateur wannabes like you into buying it.

> Yes, but it is *easier* to deal with templates which may already have
> everything ready to go for a particular project...not just the graphic
> elements for the menus from Photoshop. Why deal with importing from
> PhotoShop, AfterEffects, etc, and deal with setting everything up from
> scratch when you want to create a DVD that will have the same branding,
> functionality and so on as previous DVDs you've already produced from
> scratch?


Why create DVDs that all share the same layout??? Cookie-cutter CRAP!!!

> Creativity has nothing to do with it. A person who doesn't have a need to
> create DVDs with consistent branding, functionality, graphics, look, feel,
> etc... has no need for templates. One more time, I'll say that templates
> are not for everyone. But for a variety of people, including professionals,
> there are numerous uses for templates given a certain set of circumstances.


Again, your lowest-common-denominator definition of professional.
Look, if CrapCo wants to send out a prospectus on DVD and have it look
the same every ****ing year that's their problem. My point has always
been that templates are NOT for people serious about DVD authoring.
DVD Studio Pro is for SERIOUS people (i.e. Professionals), so CrapCo
can just use iDVD.

> Again, this is where you're just being narrow minded. You're being narrow
> minded because:
> 1) You think that the only reason why someone would want a template is if
> they are not creative enough to do their own menus.


It's not narrow-minded, it's true.

> 2) If you know how to create more than 1 video you should know how and be
> creative enough to use Photoshop. If you know how to create more than 2
> channels of sound you should know how and be creative enough to use
> Photoshop. If you know how to type (and thus create subtitles) you should
> know how and be creative enough to use Photoshop. The list goes one for all
> of the features that DVDSP has over iDVD.


You need to know more than just how to type to create subtitles. The
bottom line is, if you can actually take advantage of the advanced
features, Photoshop should be a piece of cake. Yet another giant hole
in your argument.

> It's not that hard to be a professional graphic and animation designer?
> Again, you're too narrow minded and/or too obstinate to even acknowledge
> these situations exist.


It's not that hard to use Photoshop. Get a ****ing clue.

> With DVDSP2, all the OP would need to do is get two video tracks. They
> don't even have to be the same length in DVDSP2. He selects the template
> that was made for him, and drags the videos into the dropzones. He can pull
> up the timeline and adjust the angles if he wants, and then build the
> project.
>
> VERY EASY.


It's just like Final Cut Pro. So how is working with two different
angles different than working with layers in Photoshop? If he can do
one, he can do the other.

> The word you're looking for is fallacious. The word you used sounds like
> what happens when someone slips during a Bukkake. (sorry, I normally don't
> correct typos or whatever in postings, but this time I couldn't resist
> because I thought it was too funny).


What the **** ever -- you're dreaming.

> No it's not. It sounds very much like something the OP might be interested
> in, and if not there are others who have created a market for templates.


You're an idiot. Go somewhere and die.

> Yes, it does. Use DVDSP2 and the templates and see for yourself. You
> wonder why I don't believe you're the only person in the world who can burn
> region coded DVDs with DVDSP, and it's comments like this where you're
> talking about **** you know nothing about.


I have no use for 2.0, so unless I stumble across an upgrade, there's
no reason to use it. I know how timelines work, I know how templates
work. That's all I need to know. Photoshop files are just as easy to
modify, if not easier.

> No not Hollywood DVDs. How many times must I say that? You're being way to
> narrow minded when you focus on that. There are all types of jobs out there
> in the corporate world where for many reasons the Harry Potter menu is not
> what is wanted.


Then use iDVD!!!!! How many times must I say it?????

> You do realize that DVDSP2 does not come with a suite of templates right?
> So it's not like as if they're showing it off only in terms of using the
> templates. Furthermore, you're supporting my argument here. If Apple can
> show DVDSP2 as being easy (comparable to iDVD) then why would someone buy
> it? They would only buy it if it allowed them to do some of the additional
> features not possible in iDVD.


Yes, but Apple doesn't give a **** that once they get INTO those
advanced features, they'll be lost. That's MY point.
 
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Colon Terminus
Guest
Posts: n/a
 
      11-12-2003
Hi Max,

What you don't seem to get is the limited budget that Marcellus had for his equipment. I fail to see how he could work a TBC into
that budget along with everything else.

Anyhow, I grow weary of this diversion. It's been fun, sorta, pulling the strings and watching you dance like the good little
marionette you are. So long for now, have a good life.


"Max Volume" <(E-Mail Removed)> wrote in message news:091120031952301165%(E-Mail Removed) m...
> In article <fyurb.45472$(E-Mail Removed)>, Colon Terminus
> <(E-Mail Removed)> wrote:
>
> > Please don't yell at me again, but I just have to ask. How would the original
> > poster go about copying clips from commercial DVDs to
> > include in his artists showcase video if he didn't have, or use, some
> > mechanism to defeat Macrovision?

>
> Let me clarify...
>
>
> "professional workstation" = TBC
>
> "home hobby setup" = macro buster
>
>
> "Don't bother with a home hobby setup, get a macro buster" = STUPID!!!!!
>
>
> Get it now, you ****ing retard????



 
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