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6.3 Megapixel Print Size

 
 
Hans Kruse
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      11-16-2003
I got 40x60cm prints made from pictures taken by my Canon 10D. This shold be
about 16x24" (US) (15.74" x 23.62").
Looking at these pictures from the distance of holding them in stretched
arms, they look really good. Taken by Sigma 15-30mm EX DG and Canon 28-135mm
USM IS lenses.
Since the 300D has the same resolution the print quality should be the same.
I used the Phase One DSLR RAW converter sw and no resampling in Photoshop.
--Hans

"takeone" <(E-Mail Removed)> wrote in message
news:mzOtb.83$(E-Mail Removed). com...
> I'm considering the Canon EOS Digital Rebel. What is the largest
> film-quality print that can be made from this 6.3 megapixel camera?
>
> Thanks,
> Take One
>
>



 
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David J. Littleboy
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      11-16-2003

"Annika1980" <(E-Mail Removed)> wrote:

> I've got a 12"x18" photo on the wall at our golf clubhouse, and nobody can
> believe it was captured and printed digitally.
> Most people who know such things suspect Medium Format.


People who know and love MF, love it for two reasons: the detail and the
lack of grain. 6MP digital, when combined with good technique, can deliver
that lack of grain at _any_ size. Even medium format turns grainy at some
size.

David J. Littleboy
Tokyo, Japan


 
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ArtKramr
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Posts: n/a
 
      11-17-2003
>Subject: Re: 6.3 Megapixel Print Size
>From: "David J. Littleboy" http://www.velocityreviews.com/forums/(E-Mail Removed)
>Date: 11/16/03 3:54 PM Pacific Standard Time
>Message-id: <bp92md$g0j$(E-Mail Removed)>
>
>
>"Annika1980" <(E-Mail Removed)> wrote:
>
>> I've got a 12"x18" photo on the wall at our golf clubhouse, and nobody can
>> believe it was captured and printed digitally.
>> Most people who know such things suspect Medium Format.

>
>People who know and love MF, love it for two reasons: the detail and the
>lack of grain. 6MP digital, when combined with good technique, can deliver
>that lack of grain at _any_ size. Even medium format turns grainy at some
>size.
>
>David J. Littleboy
>Tokyo, Japan
>
>

Everything turns grainy at "some size".


Arthur Kramer
344th BG 494th BS
England, France, Belgium, Holland, Germany
Visit my WW II B-26 website at:
http://www.coastcomp.com/artkramer

 
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wnor
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      11-17-2003
I had a 28X40 inch picture made on the internet from a 10D picture. Even at
a close distance, it looks wonderful, to me. I have no idea what the company
used to enlarge the picture nor what they printed it on. It is now framed
and on the wall. No one, so far, can believe it is from a digital camera.

"Hans Kruse" <(E-Mail Removed)> wrote in message
news:3fb80900$0$169$(E-Mail Removed). ..
> I got 40x60cm prints made from pictures taken by my Canon 10D. This shold

be
> about 16x24" (US) (15.74" x 23.62").
> Looking at these pictures from the distance of holding them in stretched
> arms, they look really good. Taken by Sigma 15-30mm EX DG and Canon

28-135mm
> USM IS lenses.
> Since the 300D has the same resolution the print quality should be the

same.
> I used the Phase One DSLR RAW converter sw and no resampling in Photoshop.
> --Hans
>
> "takeone" <(E-Mail Removed)> wrote in message
> news:mzOtb.83$(E-Mail Removed). com...
> > I'm considering the Canon EOS Digital Rebel. What is the largest
> > film-quality print that can be made from this 6.3 megapixel camera?
> >
> > Thanks,
> > Take One
> >
> >

>
>



 
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David J. Littleboy
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      11-17-2003

"ArtKramr" <(E-Mail Removed)> wrote:
> >From: "David J. Littleboy" (E-Mail Removed)
> >"Annika1980" <(E-Mail Removed)> wrote:
> >
> >> I've got a 12"x18" photo on the wall at our golf clubhouse, and nobody

can
> >> believe it was captured and printed digitally.
> >> Most people who know such things suspect Medium Format.

> >
> >People who know and love MF, love it for two reasons: the detail and the
> >lack of grain. 6MP digital, when combined with good technique, can

deliver
> >that lack of grain at _any_ size. Even medium format turns grainy at some
> >size.


> Everything turns grainy at "some size".


Not clean digital images. Careful interpolation (or "oversampling") of an
ISO 100 or 200 dSLR image creates a larger, pixelation and noise free,
image, albeit a very soft one. As long as you don't mind the softness, the
noise is well below what the human eye can detect.

David J. Littleboy
Tokyo, Japan


 
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Christian
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      11-17-2003
takeone wrote:

> I'm considering the Canon EOS Digital Rebel. What is the largest
> film-quality print that can be made from this 6.3 megapixel camera?


This has already been answered but I'll add two points which haven't been
made yet.

First, a lot of people will just tell you to divide the length and width (in
pixels) of the output image (3072 x 204 by 300 (or whatever dpi you want
to print at) to work out how big a given camera can print but this is
really nonsense because of the ability to rescale ("resample" or
"interpolate") the digital image. I doubled the size of some 10D images
the other day and the amount of detail it captured was quite incredible.
So basically, you can make pretty large prints with a 6MP DSLR -- not as
big as MF or as with a 1Ds but still, probably as large as most people will
ever want.

However, there is an inherent limitation no one has mentioned yet and that
is the quality of the image being captured to begin with. Obviously lower
ISOs have higher signal to noise ratios but other factors include the
quality of the lens (don't expect miracles from the kit lens!) and your
technique (suitable shutter speed, use of a tripod and mirror-lockup, which
the 300D doesn't have, etc.). If you use low ISOs and perfect technique
with good lenses then you can probably make some very large prints.
Otherwise you're definitely going to be limited at some point.
 
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Gene McCluney
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      11-17-2003
In article <mzOtb.83$(E-Mail Removed)> ,
"takeone" <(E-Mail Removed)> wrote:

> I'm considering the Canon EOS Digital Rebel. What is the largest
> film-quality print that can be made from this 6.3 megapixel camera?
>
> Thanks,
> Take One
>
>


I have a Nikon D100 among others, not a Canon, but similar pixel count.
With good post-processing technique, an excellent taking lens and
shooting "raw" you can get very acceptable 20x30 inch prints, that at
normal viewing distance look very, very good, and much smoother than
anything from a scanned 35mm slide or negative. The grain of 35mm will
definately show itself at that print size. With digital there is no
grain visible, the image is smooth.

You do need to interpolate resolution up, which can be done in
photoshop, or when you use a high quality RIP to drive your printer
(done automatically).
And of course you need to apply some amount of "unsharp mask" or other
"sharpening" processes. (Fred Miranda's Actions for PHotoshop)

I am more satisfied with my 20x30" prints from digital than I ever have
been with 35mm film. It's the lack of grain, and the smoothness of the
image.

I may start an argument here, but I think you have to look beyond
absolute pixels here, when evaluating the final print. It is what the
print looks like that counts, not how many original pixels were used to
capture the image. With a 6 mp digital SLR you can shoot (with an
excellent lens) images that can reveal more details than can be seen
with 35mm film, due to the average film's grain obscuring things.

Just like with film, to achieve the best quality prints, you need to
become skilled at the processing of the images and the printing of them,
and not rely on an outside printing service, unless they are very very
skilled at the art of making big prints from digital.

Gene McCluney
 
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Crownfield
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Posts: n/a
 
      11-17-2003
Christian wrote:
>
> takeone wrote:
>
> > I'm considering the Canon EOS Digital Rebel. What is the largest
> > film-quality print that can be made from this 6.3 megapixel camera?

>
> This has already been answered but I'll add two points which haven't been
> made yet.
>
> First, a lot of people will just tell you to divide the length and width (in
> pixels) of the output image (3072 x 204 by 300 (or whatever dpi you want
> to print at) to work out how big a given camera can print but this is
> really nonsense because of the ability to rescale ("resample" or
> "interpolate") the digital image. I doubled the size of some 10D images
> the other day and the amount of detail it captured was quite incredible.


as long as we agree that you can not upsample
and get any more detail than you started with.

for comparison,
the images you see on the side of a bus may be made at 72 ppi.


> So basically, you can make pretty large prints with a 6MP DSLR -- not as
> big as MF or as with a 1Ds but still, probably as large as most people will
> ever want.
>
> However, there is an inherent limitation no one has mentioned yet and that
> is the quality of the image being captured to begin with. Obviously lower
> ISOs have higher signal to noise ratios but other factors include the
> quality of the lens (don't expect miracles from the kit lens!) and your
> technique (suitable shutter speed, use of a tripod and mirror-lockup, which
> the 300D doesn't have, etc.). If you use low ISOs and perfect technique
> with good lenses then you can probably make some very large prints.
> Otherwise you're definitely going to be limited at some point.

 
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Crownfield
Guest
Posts: n/a
 
      11-17-2003
VT wrote:
>
> On Sun, 16 Nov 2003 17:35:14 GMT, "takeone"
> <(E-Mail Removed)> wrote:
>
> >I'm considering the Canon EOS Digital Rebel. What is the largest
> >film-quality print that can be made from this 6.3 megapixel camera?
> >

>
> For critical viewing 300ppi (pixels per inch) print densisty
> resolution is needed.


only if you are going to hold the print at the same distance
you would hold a 8x10, or an ansel adams book.

>
> The Canon Digital Rebel has 3072x2048 pixels -
> so @300ppi that's 10.24"x 6.8".
>
> However with larger prints and typical larger normal viewing distances
> the print density/resolution may not be as stringent. Also the
> concensus here for quite a while is that 200ppi is good enough for
> true photo quality prints (especially when using home inkjet photo
> printers) -
> this means @200ppi the largest print size is now: 15.4" x 10.25".
>
> Probably your best best is to download a typical test sample image
> from the Canon Digital Rebel and print to larger and larger sizes
> until you find the point where the print would be UNacceptable to you.
>
> --
> Vincent
> remove CLOTHES for e-mail
>
> http://UnknownVincent.cjb.net/

 
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takeone
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      11-17-2003
"David J. Littleboy" <(E-Mail Removed)> wrote in message
news:bp92md$g0j$(E-Mail Removed)...

> People who know and love MF, love it for two reasons: the detail and the
> lack of grain. 6MP digital, when combined with good technique, can deliver
> that lack of grain at _any_ size. Even medium format turns grainy at some
> size.
>


When you compare 6MP digital to MF, do you mean prints viewed from a
distance, or examined closely with a loupe?

Take One


 
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