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OT: HISTORIANS - I need proof the german people were guilty of the holocaust

 
 
Arawak
Guest
Posts: n/a
 
      10-16-2003
Let me preface this message by saying I love travelling to Germany and
have many german acquaintances.
I have a friend who graduated from ASU and who also represents the
U.S. on our olympic team. He is married to a colleague of mine and on
a recent cruise, I was shocked to hear him claim that he had studied
WWII extensively and knew as a fact that most germans were unaware of
the holocaust and innocent of the crimes they were accused of,
When I tried to argue the point, I realized I had no definitive
reference to provide him as proof and immediately changed the subject
to preserve our friendship as he was getting red in the face and quite
argumentative. Although my grandmother was on one of the 1st ships
which was turned away from N.Y. (since the U.S. was not yet in the
war), ending up in Jamaica, I supressed my anger during this
conversation but I have to admit it hurt me to the bone to discover
that a friend of mine had opinions so different from mine about a
subject which is very important to me.
Anyway, I am trying to find neutral (non-semetic) references on the
internet which might enlighten him.
Any suggestions would be appreciated.

TIA,
Arawak
 
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Harrison
Guest
Posts: n/a
 
      10-16-2003
Don't let the mistakes of the past undermine the hope for the future.

On Thu, 16 Oct 2003 04:39:17 GMT, Arawak <(E-Mail Removed)> wrote:

>Let me preface this message by saying I love travelling to Germany and
>have many german acquaintances.
>I have a friend who graduated from ASU and who also represents the
>U.S. on our olympic team. He is married to a colleague of mine and on
>a recent cruise, I was shocked to hear him claim that he had studied
>WWII extensively and knew as a fact that most germans were unaware of
>the holocaust and innocent of the crimes they were accused of,
>When I tried to argue the point, I realized I had no definitive
>reference to provide him as proof and immediately changed the subject
>to preserve our friendship as he was getting red in the face and quite
>argumentative. Although my grandmother was on one of the 1st ships
>which was turned away from N.Y. (since the U.S. was not yet in the
>war), ending up in Jamaica, I supressed my anger during this
>conversation but I have to admit it hurt me to the bone to discover
>that a friend of mine had opinions so different from mine about a
>subject which is very important to me.
>Anyway, I am trying to find neutral (non-semetic) references on the
>internet which might enlighten him.
>Any suggestions would be appreciated.
>
>TIA,
>Arawak


 
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Patrick
Guest
Posts: n/a
 
      10-16-2003
Thiere is plenty as to the matter with Google search "Germans ignorant of
Holocaust"
One that I had a look at was; http://www.remember.org/imagine/henchman.html

Anyway, the Germans were eventually given 'a jolly good hideing' (Dresden
etc.), thus they must have wondered what they could have done to have
deserved said 'Terror Bombing'.

Arawak wrote:
> Let me preface this message by saying I love travelling to Germany and
> have many german acquaintances.
> I have a friend who graduated from ASU and who also represents the
> U.S. on our olympic team. He is married to a colleague of mine and on
> a recent cruise, I was shocked to hear him claim that he had studied
> WWII extensively and knew as a fact that most germans were unaware of
> the holocaust and innocent of the crimes they were accused of,
> When I tried to argue the point, I realized I had no definitive
> reference to provide him as proof and immediately changed the subject
> to preserve our friendship as he was getting red in the face and quite
> argumentative. Although my grandmother was on one of the 1st ships
> which was turned away from N.Y. (since the U.S. was not yet in the
> war), ending up in Jamaica, I supressed my anger during this
> conversation but I have to admit it hurt me to the bone to discover
> that a friend of mine had opinions so different from mine about a
> subject which is very important to me.
> Anyway, I am trying to find neutral (non-semetic) references on the
> internet which might enlighten him.
> Any suggestions would be appreciated.
>
> TIA,
> Arawak



 
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Robert de Brus
Guest
Posts: n/a
 
      10-16-2003
X-No-Archive: Yes

In news:(E-Mail Removed),
Arawak <(E-Mail Removed)> typed
|| Let me preface this message by saying I love travelling to Germany
|| and have many german acquaintances.
|| I have a friend who graduated from ASU and who also represents the
|| U.S. on our olympic team. He is married to a colleague of mine and on
|| a recent cruise, I was shocked to hear him claim that he had studied
|| WWII extensively and knew as a fact that most germans were unaware of
|| the holocaust and innocent of the crimes they were accused of,

What crimes? Who said the Germans committed the holocaust?

I thought it was the Nazis who committed the holocaust???

I mean, it's like saying that the wehrmacht were nazis when, in fact, they
were simply soldiers fighting for their country. Sure, some were nazis, but
they were more often than not transferred to elite regiments where they
could kill unarmed civilians and children.

Certainly there were a lot of civilians who were nazis, but equally there
were many who were diametrically opposed, but said nothing for fear of
retribution.

|| When I tried to argue the point, I realized I had no definitive
|| reference to provide him as proof and immediately changed the subject
|| to preserve our friendship as he was getting red in the face and
|| quite argumentative. Although my grandmother was on one of the 1st
|| ships which was turned away from N.Y. (since the U.S. was not yet in
|| the war), ending up in Jamaica, I supressed my anger during this
|| conversation but I have to admit it hurt me to the bone to discover
|| that a friend of mine had opinions so different from mine about a
|| subject which is very important to me.
|| Anyway, I am trying to find neutral (non-semetic) references on the
|| internet which might enlighten him.
|| Any suggestions would be appreciated.
||
|| TIA,
|| Arawak



 
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BuffNET Tech Support - MichaelJ
Guest
Posts: n/a
 
      10-16-2003
Harrison wrote:
> Don't let the mistakes of the past undermine the hope for the future.
>
> On Thu, 16 Oct 2003 04:39:17 GMT, Arawak <(E-Mail Removed)> wrote:
>
>
>>Let me preface this message by saying I love travelling to Germany and
>>have many german acquaintances..........


>>Anyway, I am trying to find neutral (non-semetic) references on the
>>internet which might enlighten him.
>>Any suggestions would be appreciated.


I would suggest a simple search on the Library Of Congress or US Army
web sites would give you what you need....

Failing that, PLEASE visit a Sr center and speak to someone about it....
before they're no longer with us.

--
--
http://www.velocityreviews.com/forums/(E-Mail Removed)
BuffNET Technical Support Supervisor
(BEHOLD! The power of the BOFH!)

 
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MrG
Guest
Posts: n/a
 
      10-16-2003
Turn on the History channel, Discovery, or UK History at any time. They are
awash with documentaries giving first hand accounts of events, many of them
by German soldiers and civilians. It's a lesson for the world how
governments can mislead their people with propaganda and promises of
reclaiming what was lost.

We owe it to all the people who died in the war and as a result of crimes
commited by all parties, on all sides, not to forget. It is easy to
question and doubt from a position of ignorance, but you do so at the
expense of your future, and the memory of those who died.

In the Information Age, there really is no excuse for ignorance.


"Arawak" <(E-Mail Removed)> wrote in message
news:(E-Mail Removed)...
> Let me preface this message by saying I love travelling to Germany and
> have many german acquaintances.
> I have a friend who graduated from ASU and who also represents the
> U.S. on our olympic team. He is married to a colleague of mine and on
> a recent cruise, I was shocked to hear him claim that he had studied
> WWII extensively and knew as a fact that most germans were unaware of
> the holocaust and innocent of the crimes they were accused of,
> When I tried to argue the point, I realized I had no definitive
> reference to provide him as proof and immediately changed the subject
> to preserve our friendship as he was getting red in the face and quite
> argumentative. Although my grandmother was on one of the 1st ships
> which was turned away from N.Y. (since the U.S. was not yet in the
> war), ending up in Jamaica, I supressed my anger during this
> conversation but I have to admit it hurt me to the bone to discover
> that a friend of mine had opinions so different from mine about a
> subject which is very important to me.
> Anyway, I am trying to find neutral (non-semetic) references on the
> internet which might enlighten him.
> Any suggestions would be appreciated.
>
> TIA,
> Arawak



 
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Arawak
Guest
Posts: n/a
 
      10-17-2003
My mistake, I thought the Nazis were Germans except for their Austrian
leader.
So if we as a people witness genocide within our own borders and
although, diametrically opposed, do nothing but look the other way due
to fear of retribution then we must be considered innocent in
hindsight? That must be a christian charity I missed.
Anyway, I was not looking to argue semantics, just getting references
which a few others were kind enough to provide.
I value your opinion and realize there will always be different
interpretation of history.

On Thu, 16 Oct 2003 20:48:34 +1000, "Robert de Brus" <de_brus@h o t m
a i l.com> wrote:

>X-No-Archive: Yes
>
>In news:(E-Mail Removed),
>Arawak <(E-Mail Removed)> typed
>|| Let me preface this message by saying I love travelling to Germany
>|| and have many german acquaintances.
>|| I have a friend who graduated from ASU and who also represents the
>|| U.S. on our olympic team. He is married to a colleague of mine and on
>|| a recent cruise, I was shocked to hear him claim that he had studied
>|| WWII extensively and knew as a fact that most germans were unaware of
>|| the holocaust and innocent of the crimes they were accused of,
>
>What crimes? Who said the Germans committed the holocaust?
>
>I thought it was the Nazis who committed the holocaust???
>
>I mean, it's like saying that the wehrmacht were nazis when, in fact, they
>were simply soldiers fighting for their country. Sure, some were nazis, but
>they were more often than not transferred to elite regiments where they
>could kill unarmed civilians and children.
>
>Certainly there were a lot of civilians who were nazis, but equally there
>were many who were diametrically opposed, but said nothing for fear of
>retribution.
>
>|| When I tried to argue the point, I realized I had no definitive
>|| reference to provide him as proof and immediately changed the subject
>|| to preserve our friendship as he was getting red in the face and
>|| quite argumentative. Although my grandmother was on one of the 1st
>|| ships which was turned away from N.Y. (since the U.S. was not yet in
>|| the war), ending up in Jamaica, I supressed my anger during this
>|| conversation but I have to admit it hurt me to the bone to discover
>|| that a friend of mine had opinions so different from mine about a
>|| subject which is very important to me.
>|| Anyway, I am trying to find neutral (non-semetic) references on the
>|| internet which might enlighten him.
>|| Any suggestions would be appreciated.
>||
>|| TIA,
>|| Arawak
>
>


 
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Scribner
Guest
Posts: n/a
 
      10-17-2003
I seem to remember that Hitler was democratically elected by the
German people. He was an Austrian citizen, but through a loophole
(minor political appointment) he obtained German citizenship. Then he
was elected (first politician to fly) and then he took over
(liberated) the Ostreich (Austria). It has been put forth that the
large numbers of Austrians in the SS was due to their feelings of
inferiority to the Germans. Anyway, when Hitler came to power, all of
the military forces, each individual soldier and sailor, swore an oath
of personal allegiance to Adolf Hitler (2 Aug. 1934). The oath ran:
""I swear by almighty God this sacred oath: I will render
unconditional obedience
to the Fuehrer of the German Reich and people, Adolf Hitler,
Supreme Commander of the Wehrmacht, and, as a brave soldier,
I will be ready at any time to stake my life for this oath." The
Hitler Jung also had to swear a similar oath on an annual basis. The
military oath was subsequently taken by each soldier or sailor as they
entered military service. So, if Hitler was a Nazi (I think that his
membership number was #5), and the military and youth swore an oath of
unconditional obedience to him, then they should probably be
considered Nazis, also. Then there are the common people who
popularly elected him. They can't claim ignorance because his
blueprint, "Mein Kamph" came out before he was elected Chancellor.
Between the military and the voters (not to mention the loyal Party
members, and the SA) that should be a pretty fair chunk of the
population. That chunk gets even better if you eliminate (no pun
intended) from the population everyone who was put into a
concentration camp or simply executed. As for the part of ignorance,
every "good" German family had a Bible and "Mein Kamph" (unless you
were part of the SS or SD, then there was supposed to be no Bible).
They were also supposed to have read "Mein Kamph." If they couldn't
figure out the ramifications of "Liebestraum" then they were idiots.


On Fri, 17 Oct 2003 05:22:19 GMT, Arawak <(E-Mail Removed)> wrote:

>My mistake, I thought the Nazis were Germans except for their Austrian
>leader.
>So if we as a people witness genocide within our own borders and
>although, diametrically opposed, do nothing but look the other way due
>to fear of retribution then we must be considered innocent in
>hindsight? That must be a christian charity I missed.
>Anyway, I was not looking to argue semantics, just getting references
>which a few others were kind enough to provide.
>I value your opinion and realize there will always be different
>interpretation of history.
>
>On Thu, 16 Oct 2003 20:48:34 +1000, "Robert de Brus" <de_brus@h o t m
>a i l.com> wrote:
>
>>X-No-Archive: Yes
>>
>>In news:(E-Mail Removed),
>>Arawak <(E-Mail Removed)> typed
>>|| Let me preface this message by saying I love travelling to Germany
>>|| and have many german acquaintances.
>>|| I have a friend who graduated from ASU and who also represents the
>>|| U.S. on our olympic team. He is married to a colleague of mine and on
>>|| a recent cruise, I was shocked to hear him claim that he had studied
>>|| WWII extensively and knew as a fact that most germans were unaware of
>>|| the holocaust and innocent of the crimes they were accused of,
>>
>>What crimes? Who said the Germans committed the holocaust?


Well, let's see. The crematoriums were designed and patented by the
Germans. The soldiers who guarded the death camps were from either
Germany or Austria (which was absorbed into Germany before the war).
The gold, and other material, gleaned from the victims of the
Holocaust ended up in German bank vaults. Oh, and the surviving
eyewitness death camp survivors who said that the Germans did.



>>
>>I thought it was the Nazis who committed the holocaust???
>>
>>I mean, it's like saying that the wehrmacht were nazis when, in fact, they
>>were simply soldiers fighting for their country. Sure, some were nazis, but
>>they were more often than not transferred to elite regiments where they
>>could kill unarmed civilians and children.


True, more blatant atrocities were probably carried out by the SS, but
if you consider the fact that WW II began by the German military being
attacked by dead Germans dressed in Polish uniforms (Operation Canned
Goods), then the war itself was an unprovoked act of aggression
carried out by the regular forces. Which is a greater atrocity,
killing the civilian population of a town (SS) or attacking defending
soldiers armed with lances and mounted on horseback with tanks
(Wehrmacht). Oh, I forgot the Air Force's little tactic of forcing
civilians onto the roads so that the defending military couldn't send
forward needed military units. The Reich military were not fighting
for The Fatherland. They were fighting for Adolf Hitler PERSONALLY.
>>
>>Certainly there were a lot of civilians who were nazis, but equally there
>>were many who were diametrically opposed, but said nothing for fear of
>>retribution.


I find it doubtful if the number of free Germans who were against
Hitler's policies on June 1, 1940 (when Hitler was winning - it is
easy to be against him when he is losing) was greater than the total
German population killed or incarcerated by the Nazis from 1936 to
1945. Remember, they were "knifed in the back" and lost WW I. Then
they had the Treaty of Versailles, the loss of the Ruhr Valley, and
the Depression to deal with. They were the ultimate underdogs, in
their eyes. So to finally be able to stick it to those who had been
sticking it to them felt damn good. They had jobs, military success,
and a chance at an Empire. What was there not to love?
>>
>>|| When I tried to argue the point, I realized I had no definitive
>>|| reference to provide him as proof and immediately changed the subject
>>|| to preserve our friendship as he was getting red in the face and
>>|| quite argumentative. Although my grandmother was on one of the 1st
>>|| ships which was turned away from N.Y. (since the U.S. was not yet in
>>|| the war), ending up in Jamaica, I supressed my anger during this
>>|| conversation but I have to admit it hurt me to the bone to discover
>>|| that a friend of mine had opinions so different from mine about a
>>|| subject which is very important to me.
>>|| Anyway, I am trying to find neutral (non-semetic) references on the
>>|| internet which might enlighten him.
>>|| Any suggestions would be appreciated.
>>||
>>|| TIA,
>>|| Arawak
>>
>>


 
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Robert de Brus
Guest
Posts: n/a
 
      10-17-2003
X-No-Archive: Yes

In news:(E-Mail Removed),
Arawak <(E-Mail Removed)> typed
|| My mistake, I thought the Nazis were Germans except for their
|| Austrian leader.

Are you serious?

With that ridiculous logic, all Germans are guilty because some Germans were
Nazis?

So a distant relative of yours kills someone, you should be executed for it.

Sounds great to me

what are you having for you last meal, BOZO?

|| So if we as a people witness genocide within our own borders and
|| although, diametrically opposed, do nothing but look the other way
|| due
|| to fear of retribution then we must be considered innocent in
|| hindsight? That must be a christian charity I missed.

Nothing to do with Christianity

You've never been in such a situation so how can you possibly know what
these people might or might not have felt or thought?

What a ****ing st00pid thing to say.

|| Anyway, I was not looking to argue semantics, just getting references

sure, sure

|| which a few others were kind enough to provide.
|| I value your opinion and realize there will always be different
|| interpretation of history.
||
|| On Thu, 16 Oct 2003 20:48:34 +1000, "Robert de Brus" <de_brus@h o t m
|| a i l.com> wrote:
||
||| X-No-Archive: Yes
|||
||| In news:(E-Mail Removed),
||| Arawak <(E-Mail Removed)> typed
||||| Let me preface this message by saying I love travelling to Germany
||||| and have many german acquaintances.
||||| I have a friend who graduated from ASU and who also represents the
||||| U.S. on our olympic team. He is married to a colleague of mine
||||| and on
||||| a recent cruise, I was shocked to hear him claim that he had
||||| studied WWII extensively and knew as a fact that most germans
||||| were unaware of the holocaust and innocent of the crimes they
||||| were accused of,
|||
||| What crimes? Who said the Germans committed the holocaust?
|||
||| I thought it was the Nazis who committed the holocaust???
|||
||| I mean, it's like saying that the wehrmacht were nazis when, in
||| fact, they were simply soldiers fighting for their country. Sure,
||| some were nazis, but they were more often than not transferred to
||| elite regiments where they could kill unarmed civilians and
||| children.
|||
||| Certainly there were a lot of civilians who were nazis, but equally
||| there were many who were diametrically opposed, but said nothing
||| for fear of retribution.
|||
||||| When I tried to argue the point, I realized I had no definitive
||||| reference to provide him as proof and immediately changed the
||||| subject to preserve our friendship as he was getting red in the
||||| face and
||||| quite argumentative. Although my grandmother was on one of the 1st
||||| ships which was turned away from N.Y. (since the U.S. was not yet
||||| in the war), ending up in Jamaica, I supressed my anger during
||||| this conversation but I have to admit it hurt me to the bone to
||||| discover that a friend of mine had opinions so different from
||||| mine about a subject which is very important to me.
||||| Anyway, I am trying to find neutral (non-semetic) references on
||||| the internet which might enlighten him.
||||| Any suggestions would be appreciated.
|||||
||||| TIA,
||||| Arawak



 
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Robert de Brus
Guest
Posts: n/a
 
      10-17-2003
X-No-Archive: Yes

In news:(E-Mail Removed),
Scribner <walter3ca@no_spam_yahoo.com> typed
|| I seem to remember that Hitler was democratically elected by the
|| German people. He was an Austrian citizen, but through a loophole

So have been many idiots

|| (minor political appointment) he obtained German citizenship. Then
|| he
|| was elected (first politician to fly) and then he took over
|| (liberated) the Ostreich (Austria). It has been put forth that the
|| large numbers of Austrians in the SS was due to their feelings of
|| inferiority to the Germans. Anyway, when Hitler came to power, all
|| of
|| the military forces, each individual soldier and sailor, swore an
|| oath
|| of personal allegiance to Adolf Hitler (2 Aug. 1934). The oath ran:
|| ""I swear by almighty God this sacred oath: I will render
|| unconditional obedience
|| to the Fuehrer of the German Reich and people, Adolf Hitler,
|| Supreme Commander of the Wehrmacht, and, as a brave soldier,
|| I will be ready at any time to stake my life for this oath." The

No soldier has ever lied. No German has ever lied under oath. Nobody has
ever taken an oath for the sake of a job or because they were drafded
(forced to).

|| Hitler Jung also had to swear a similar oath on an annual basis. The
|| military oath was subsequently taken by each soldier or sailor as

Kids, many pre pubescent, who knew what it was all about, none of who were
brainwashed with propaganda.

|| they entered military service. So, if Hitler was a Nazi (I think
|| that his membership number was #5), and the military and youth swore
|| an oath of unconditional obedience to him, then they should probably
|| be
|| considered Nazis, also. Then there are the common people who

What a absolutely st00pid conclusion

|| popularly elected him. They can't claim ignorance because his

He was elected by the German people because they knew he was going to murder
6,000,000 jewish men, women, and children.

|| blueprint, "Mein Kamph" came out before he was elected Chancellor.
|| Between the military and the voters (not to mention the loyal Party
|| members, and the SA) that should be a pretty fair chunk of the
|| population. That chunk gets even better if you eliminate (no pun
|| intended) from the population everyone who was put into a
|| concentration camp or simply executed. As for the part of ignorance,
|| every "good" German family had a Bible and "Mein Kamph" (unless you

To prove they were good Germans in case the Nazis came a knockin'

|| were part of the SS or SD, then there was supposed to be no Bible).

Why? Even the SS oath mentions God, even though they were not supposed to
believe.

|| They were also supposed to have read "Mein Kamph." If they couldn't
|| figure out the ramifications of "Liebestraum" then they were idiots.
||
||
|| On Fri, 17 Oct 2003 05:22:19 GMT, Arawak <(E-Mail Removed)> wrote:
||
||| My mistake, I thought the Nazis were Germans except for their
||| Austrian leader.
||| So if we as a people witness genocide within our own borders and
||| although, diametrically opposed, do nothing but look the other way
||| due
||| to fear of retribution then we must be considered innocent in
||| hindsight? That must be a christian charity I missed.
||| Anyway, I was not looking to argue semantics, just getting
||| references
||| which a few others were kind enough to provide.
||| I value your opinion and realize there will always be different
||| interpretation of history.
|||
||| On Thu, 16 Oct 2003 20:48:34 +1000, "Robert de Brus" <de_brus@h o t
||| m
||| a i l.com> wrote:
|||
|||| X-No-Archive: Yes
||||
|||| In news:(E-Mail Removed),
|||| Arawak <(E-Mail Removed)> typed
|||||| Let me preface this message by saying I love travelling to
|||||| Germany
|||||| and have many german acquaintances.
|||||| I have a friend who graduated from ASU and who also represents
|||||| the
|||||| U.S. on our olympic team. He is married to a colleague of mine
|||||| and on
|||||| a recent cruise, I was shocked to hear him claim that he had
|||||| studied WWII extensively and knew as a fact that most germans
|||||| were unaware of the holocaust and innocent of the crimes they
|||||| were accused of,
||||
|||| What crimes? Who said the Germans committed the holocaust?
||
|| Well, let's see. The crematoriums were designed and patented by the
|| Germans. The soldiers who guarded the death camps were from either

By *all* Germans, or just a few?

|| Germany or Austria (which was absorbed into Germany before the war).

Ummm, not entirely true. In fact many guards in camps outside of Germany
were captured locals.

|| The gold, and other material, gleaned from the victims of the
|| Holocaust ended up in German bank vaults. Oh, and the surviving

Ummm, Swiss actually

|| eyewitness death camp survivors who said that the Germans did.

Again, would that be *all* Germans, or just the ones these people knew
about?


Where are you from, I'd like to accuse you of an attrocity by association.
Numbskull!

||
||
||
||||
|||| I thought it was the Nazis who committed the holocaust???
||||
|||| I mean, it's like saying that the wehrmacht were nazis when, in
|||| fact, they were simply soldiers fighting for their country. Sure,
|||| some were nazis, but they were more often than not transferred to
|||| elite regiments where they could kill unarmed civilians and
|||| children.
||
|| True, more blatant atrocities were probably carried out by the SS,
|| but
|| if you consider the fact that WW II began by the German military
|| being attacked by dead Germans dressed in Polish uniforms (Operation
|| Canned Goods), then the war itself was an unprovoked act of
|| aggression
|| carried out by the regular forces. Which is a greater atrocity,
|| killing the civilian population of a town (SS) or attacking defending
|| soldiers armed with lances and mounted on horseback with tanks
|| (Wehrmacht). Oh, I forgot the Air Force's little tactic of forcing
|| civilians onto the roads so that the defending military couldn't send
|| forward needed military units. The Reich military were not fighting
|| for The Fatherland. They were fighting for Adolf Hitler PERSONALLY.
||||
|||| Certainly there were a lot of civilians who were nazis, but
|||| equally there were many who were diametrically opposed, but said
|||| nothing for fear of retribution.
||
|| I find it doubtful if the number of free Germans who were against
|| Hitler's policies on June 1, 1940 (when Hitler was winning - it is
|| easy to be against him when he is losing) was greater than the total
|| German population killed or incarcerated by the Nazis from 1936 to
|| 1945. Remember, they were "knifed in the back" and lost WW I. Then
|| they had the Treaty of Versailles, the loss of the Ruhr Valley, and
|| the Depression to deal with. They were the ultimate underdogs, in
|| their eyes. So to finally be able to stick it to those who had been
|| sticking it to them felt damn good. They had jobs, military success,
|| and a chance at an Empire. What was there not to love?
||||
|||||| When I tried to argue the point, I realized I had no definitive
|||||| reference to provide him as proof and immediately changed the
|||||| subject to preserve our friendship as he was getting red in the
|||||| face and
|||||| quite argumentative. Although my grandmother was on one of the
|||||| 1st ships which was turned away from N.Y. (since the U.S. was
|||||| not yet in the war), ending up in Jamaica, I supressed my anger
|||||| during this conversation but I have to admit it hurt me to the
|||||| bone to discover that a friend of mine had opinions so different
|||||| from mine about a subject which is very important to me.
|||||| Anyway, I am trying to find neutral (non-semetic) references on
|||||| the internet which might enlighten him.
|||||| Any suggestions would be appreciated.
||||||
|||||| TIA,
|||||| Arawak



 
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