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Resize table problem in Firefox for Web App

 
 
Giggle Girl
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      04-21-2006
Hi there,
I am having a problem with the behavior of Firefox, where lefthand
column content is not resized properly after it is "collapsed" and then
"re-expanded". An online demo is available here:

http://s161149005.onlinehome.us/DEMO...n/frameset.asp

It works fine in IE 6, but in Firefox, it is broken. Specifically,
when the page/frameset first loads in either browser, it looks correct.
But when you click the "yellow minimizer" (see demo) and the column
collapses, and then click the "expander", the table layout in Firefox
becomes compressed.

I am not sure if this is an "onresize" problem (since the "onload"
sizing works), or if it is an HTML problem (where Firefox does not like
tables with 100% width when the holding frame size changes), or
something else I cannot think of.

BUT! I appreciate any and all help.

If I can get the behavior of this example to act the same in IE as
Firefox, I would be a happy camper.

This will become a web application, and only has to work in recent
versions of IE and Firefox.

Thanks,
Ann

 
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Quitchat
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      04-21-2006
Hi there,
Just would like you to konw that your page works fine in my
Firefox(v1.5.0.2),or at least it works the same way it does in my IE
6.0.


Regards,
QC

 
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Touffy
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      04-21-2006
On 2006-04-21 17:28:37 +0200, "Giggle Girl" <(E-Mail Removed)> said:

> Hi there,
> I am having a problem with the behavior of Firefox, where lefthand
> column content is not resized properly after it is "collapsed" and then
> "re-expanded". An online demo is available here:
>
> http://s161149005.onlinehome.us/DEMO...n/frameset.asp
>
> It works fine in IE 6, but in Firefox, it is broken. Specifically,
> when the page/frameset first loads in either browser, it looks correct.
> But when you click the "yellow minimizer" (see demo) and the column
> collapses, and then click the "expander", the table layout in Firefox
> becomes compressed.


I just tried it in Safari 2.0.3 and Firefox 1.5.0.2 (on OS X) and it
works fine in both browsers.


--
David Junger

 
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PeterMcC
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      04-21-2006
Quitchat wrote in
<(E-Mail Removed) .com>

> Hi there,
> Just would like you to konw that your page works fine in my
> Firefox(v1.5.0.2),or at least it works the same way it does in my IE
> 6.0.


Thanks

--
PeterMcC
If you feel that any of the above is incorrect,
inappropriate or offensive in any way,
please ignore it and accept my apologies.
 
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Giggle Girl
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      04-21-2006

Touffy wrote:
> On 2006-04-21 17:28:37 +0200, "Giggle Girl" <(E-Mail Removed)> said:
>
> > Hi there,
> > I am having a problem with the behavior of Firefox, where lefthand
> > column content is not resized properly after it is "collapsed" and then
> > "re-expanded". An online demo is available here:
> >
> > http://s161149005.onlinehome.us/DEMO...n/frameset.asp
> >
> > It works fine in IE 6, but in Firefox, it is broken. Specifically,
> > when the page/frameset first loads in either browser, it looks correct.
> > But when you click the "yellow minimizer" (see demo) and the column
> > collapses, and then click the "expander", the table layout in Firefox
> > becomes compressed.

>
> I just tried it in Safari 2.0.3 and Firefox 1.5.0.2 (on OS X) and it
> works fine in both browsers.
>
>
> --
> David Junger


Thank you Quitchat and Touffy for the rapid feedback!

Yes, it does work fine in Firefox afterall!

When I saw your surprising responses, I checked my FF version. It was
1.0.6, so I uninstalled and installed the newest (1.5.0.2) and it
works!

Hurray!

Thanks for the quick feedback,
Ann

 
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David
Guest
Posts: n/a
 
      04-21-2006
Giggle Girl wrote:
> Hi there,
> I am having a problem with the behavior of Firefox, where lefthand
> column content is not resized properly after it is "collapsed" and then
> "re-expanded". An online demo is available here:
>
> http://s161149005.onlinehome.us/DEMO...n/frameset.asp
>
> It works fine in IE 6, but in Firefox, it is broken. Specifically,
> when the page/frameset first loads in either browser, it looks correct.
> But when you click the "yellow minimizer" (see demo) and the column
> collapses, and then click the "expander", the table layout in Firefox
> becomes compressed.
>
> I am not sure if this is an "onresize" problem (since the "onload"
> sizing works), or if it is an HTML problem (where Firefox does not like
> tables with 100% width when the holding frame size changes), or
> something else I cannot think of.
>
> BUT! I appreciate any and all help.
>
> If I can get the behavior of this example to act the same in IE as
> Firefox, I would be a happy camper.
>
> This will become a web application, and only has to work in recent
> versions of IE and Firefox.
>
> Thanks,
> Ann
>

Sheesh,
Perhaps I am blind, but it looks find in my browser FireFox 1.5.0.2
Looks the same in Konqueror 3.5.2 also
 
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=?ISO-8859-1?Q?G=E9rard_Talbot?=
Guest
Posts: n/a
 
      04-26-2006
Giggle Girl wrote :
> Touffy wrote:
>> On 2006-04-21 17:28:37 +0200, "Giggle Girl" <(E-Mail Removed)> said:
>>
>>> Hi there,
>>> I am having a problem with the behavior of Firefox, where lefthand
>>> column content is not resized properly after it is "collapsed" and then
>>> "re-expanded". An online demo is available here:
>>>
>>> http://s161149005.onlinehome.us/DEMO...n/frameset.asp
>>>
>>> It works fine in IE 6, but in Firefox, it is broken. Specifically,
>>> when the page/frameset first loads in either browser, it looks correct.
>>> But when you click the "yellow minimizer" (see demo) and the column
>>> collapses, and then click the "expander", the table layout in Firefox
>>> becomes compressed.

>> I just tried it in Safari 2.0.3 and Firefox 1.5.0.2 (on OS X) and it
>> works fine in both browsers.
>>
>>
>> --
>> David Junger

>
> Thank you Quitchat and Touffy for the rapid feedback!
>
> Yes, it does work fine in Firefox afterall!
>
> When I saw your surprising responses, I checked my FF version. It was
> 1.0.6, so I uninstalled and installed the newest (1.5.0.2) and it
> works!
>
> Hurray!
>
> Thanks for the quick feedback,
> Ann
>


You could try better with entirely valid markup code to begin with. Your
top frameset has 2 nested framesets and there is one missing a closing
tag: there is one without a </frameset>.

framespacing=0 is also invalid and unneeded if you're using border="0".

Your other framed documents also have markup errors.

The chances your DHTML working in Firefox 1.0.x would be increased if
you were using valid markup code in all your framed documents
(preferably with a strict DTD) and in your top frameset.

HTML Tidy extension for Firefox users
http://users.skynet.be/mgueury/mozilla/index.html

Why we won't help you
http://diveintomark.org/archives/200..._wont_help_you

HTML markup validator
http://validator.w3.org/

Gérard
--
remove blah to email me
 
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=?ISO-8859-1?Q?G=E9rard_Talbot?=
Guest
Posts: n/a
 
      04-26-2006
Giggle Girl a écrit :
> Hi there,
> I am having a problem with the behavior of Firefox, where lefthand
> column content is not resized properly after it is "collapsed" and then
> "re-expanded". An online demo is available here:
>
> http://s161149005.onlinehome.us/DEMO...n/frameset.asp
>
> It works fine in IE 6, but in Firefox, it is broken. Specifically,
> when the page/frameset first loads in either browser, it looks correct.
> But when you click the "yellow minimizer" (see demo) and the column
> collapses, and then click the "expander", the table layout in Firefox
> becomes compressed.
>
> I am not sure if this is an "onresize" problem (since the "onload"
> sizing works), or if it is an HTML problem (where Firefox does not like
> tables with 100% width when the holding frame size changes), or
> something else I cannot think of.
>
> BUT! I appreciate any and all help.
>
> If I can get the behavior of this example to act the same in IE as
> Firefox, I would be a happy camper.
>
> This will become a web application, and only has to work in recent
> versions of IE and Firefox.
>
> Thanks,
> Ann
>


I forgot the obvious. Just by setting your left frame with

border="4"

and by removing the noresize attribute, you would make your left frame
and frameset design accessible in case javascript support is disabled or
inexistent, and that is not to say also more flexible, user-friendly for
your visitors. Users dislike sites that over-constrain and over-control
them. Why make complex and javascript-driven when simple and not
dependent on javascript can be done?

Your top-most frame has 0 rows: obviously, there are lots of things that
you do in that webpage that I would not even consider doing. I would
first of all get rid of all the frames.



"
Frames introduced several usability problem that caused several
commentators to advise Web site builders to avoid them at all costs.
Examples of such usability problems are:

1- * The [back] button works unintuitively in many cases.
2- * You cannot bookmark a collection of documents in a frameset.
3- * If you do a [reload], the result may be different to what you had.
4- * [page up] and [page down] are often hard to do.
5- * You can get trapped in a frameset.
6- * Searching finds HTML pages, not Framed pages, so search results
usually give you pages without the navigation context that they were
intended to be in.
7- * Since you can't content negotiatiate, noframes markup is
necessary for user agents that don't support frames. However, almost no
one produces noframes content, and so it ruins Web searches, since
search engines are examples of user agents that do not support frames.
8- * There are security problems caused by the fact that it is not
visible to the user when different frames come from different sources.
"

All taken from XFrames
http://www.w3.org/TR/2002/WD-xframes-20020806/#s_intro

9- The fact that the content frame is without navigation makes such
document incoherent when isolated. The fact that the navigation frame is
without an explicit reference to content makes such document illogical
when isolated, when taken out of context. When you load a frameset, if
one of the 2 framed-documents has a loading problem of some sort, then
it affects the usage of both documents.

10- There are also copyright infringment issues: with frames, it is
possible to display someone else's site into one's own without his/her
prior formal approval. Linking to other sites within a frameset can pose
some legal problems. "frame-spoofing (a web site inserting content into
a frame that appears to be from another site)"

11-
"Interface Design

Frames promote poor interface design. If you have all your navigation in
its own frame, how do you account for users who come from other places?
Keep in mind the example above, search engines can bring a user right
into the guts of your site. It is easy to forget that people can make
their way in to the HTML page of a frame, and when they do, how do you
plan to allow them to get to your home page? Or how do you indicate to
the user that it is your site? These are all questions that should be
answered before the design is even begun since supporting them requires
some trade-offs in the overall site layout. Most navigation frames do
not indicate the current page. (...) "

- Search engines have problems with frames:
Here's what google.com says about frames:
Google Information for Webmasters
"
My webpages have never been included in the Google index.

2. My site's been live for a few months.
(...)
It's also possible that we're not able to crawl your site due to
technical reasons. A few of the most common ones are listed below:
(...)
* Your pages use frames. Google supports frames to the extent
that we can. Frames tend to cause problems with search engines,
bookmarks, emailing links and so on, because frames don't fit the
conceptual model of the web (every page corresponds to a single URL). If
a user's query matches the page as a whole, Google returns the frame
set. If a user's query matches an individual frame on the page, Google
returns the URL for that frame. The page is not displayed in a frame
because there may be no frame set corresponding to that URL.
(...)
"
taken from Google Information for Webmasters
http://www.google.com/webmasters/2.html


Meta-resource
Why are frames so evil? (this page has 12 links/resources on the issue)
http://html-faq.com/htmlframes/?framesareevil

Why Frames Suck (Most of the Time)
http://www.useit.com/alertbox/9612.html

Problems with using frames
http://www.allmyfaqs.com/faq.pl?Prob...h_using_frames


Gérard
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mehtajigar@gmail.com
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      04-27-2006
hey ann, i wud like to have a view at ur script if u dont mind coz i
might need the same functionaliy to be used in near future.

 
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Thomas 'PointedEars' Lahn
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      04-27-2006
http://www.velocityreviews.com/forums/(E-Mail Removed) wrote:

> hey ann, i wud like to have a view at ur script if u dont mind coz i
> might need the same functionaliy to be used in near future.


You need a new keyboard first.


PointedEars
--
When you have eliminated all which is impossible, then
whatever remains, however improbable, must be the truth.
-- Sherlock Holmes in Sir Arthur Conan Doyle's
"The Blanched Soldier"

 
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