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> For me, the jury is still out on AJAX.

Why? We've being doing this sort of stuff for 6 years.

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Hywel

wrote:
> > For me, the jury is still out on AJAX.
> Why? We've being doing this sort of stuff for 6 years.

Because I havent seen an advantage over Flash. My Expierience has been
that Flash applications are much more powerful, flexible, and portable.


YMMV

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-=tn=-

Andy Dingley wrote:
> >Why would you have to do 3 implementations?
> Three implementations - good.
> Effort of doing three implementations - bad.
> Lets see how we put the business logic in our three different places: on
> the server at form submission time, on the client, and on the server and
> being used interactively by the client (through AJAX).

There is where we disagree. Putting the business logic in 3 places.

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-=tn=-

Travis Newbury wrote:
> wrote:
>
>>>For me, the jury is still out on AJAX.
>>
>>Why? We've being doing this sort of stuff for 6 years.
>
>
> Because I havent seen an advantage over Flash. My Expierience has been
> that Flash applications are much more powerful, flexible, and portable.
>

Why are we discussing this with a flash-only developer? And what is a
flash-only developer doing this newsgroup?

Woolly Mittens wrote:
> Travis Newbury wrote:
> >>>For me, the jury is still out on AJAX.
> >>Why? We've being doing this sort of stuff for 6 years.
> > Because I havent seen an advantage over Flash. My Expierience has been
> > that Flash applications are much more powerful, flexible, and portable.
> Why are we discussing this with a flash-only developer? And what is a
> flash-only developer doing this newsgroup?

Who said only?

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-=tn=-

On Thu, 28 Jul 2005 17:11:54 +0200, Woolly Mittens
<> wrote:

>Why are we discussing this with a flash-only developer?

Because Flash developers are the experts and we might learn something.

Flash sucks if you rely on the HTTP submission mechanism. A new page
means potentialy having to re-load the Flash. So as a result, the Flash
community were some of the first to develop widespread use of asych
techniques in web-apps. Macs seemed particuarly commonly used for this,
with Flash and XML-RPC turning into "Visual Basic for the Web"

On 28 Jul 2005 03:03:05 -0700, "Travis Newbury"
<> wrote:

>There is where we disagree. Putting the business logic in 3 places.

You have to have it on the server, because you need to validate the
final submission.

You also want to have it available on the client, because that improves
usability. There are two efficient approaches to this: one is to
describe the logic formally by some form of predicate calculus. This
then generates different code for each platform automatically, but with
equivalent function. The other way is to code a distributable object to
some standard interface, then run copies of it on each platform.

The third option, that of asynch validation on the server may also use
these techniques, but usually it's done by proxying onto the same logic
already done for the server. Again this proxy layer is automatcially
produced.

Andy Dingley wrote:
> Because Flash developers are the experts and we might learn something.
> Flash sucks if you rely on the HTTP submission mechanism...

Spoken as a man with little or no knowledge of Flash.



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-=tn=-

Andy Dingle wrote:
>>There is where we disagree. Putting the business logic in 3 places.
> You have to have it on the server, because you need to validate the
> final submission.
> You also want to have it available on the client, because that improves
> usability.

It only improves usability if you reply on client side code. I
personally thing that is, well dumb.


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-=tn=-

On Thu, 28 Jul 2005 18:44:13 -0400, Travis Newbury
<> wrote:

>> Flash sucks if you rely on the HTTP submission mechanism...
>
>Spoken as a man with little or no knowledge of Flash.

Flash sucks if you rely on the HTTP submission mechanism - the same
mechanism that is the default way of working for HTML forms. That's why
Flash developers were early adopters of the whole asynch approach.

How often do you see a HTML page with a "Loading..." spinner ? Flash
takes a hit when you do a reload of it. If you're good, it's a small
hit, but it's still too slow for an interactive app.