«

Hello everyone,
Is there a discussion on emacs vs eclipse? Are there any advantages of
emacs over eclipse?

I'm a grad student and I've been using emacs for over 6 years ( it was
the first thing I ever tried and it worked for me). Recently, I had to
"take over" a project and improve it. I didn't have the
design/documentation. The only thing I had was the code ( about 500
java files, 55 packages and 112kloc) developed over 5 years (yes, it
is a research project).

Using eclipse helped me quickly understand the code. Eclipse helped me
efficiently search/navigate between files and methods. I found the
eclipse ide to be more powerful than the emacs-ide
(http://jdee.sunsite.dk/).

Given that eclipse has plugins for C/Java/Latex and runs on Linux/Win,
I don't see a reason why I should stick with emacs.

I would like to know why emacs-users (who have also tried eclipse) are
still sticking with emacs ?

An Eclipse Convert.

"slowCoder" <> wrote in message
news: om...
> Hello everyone,
> Is there a discussion on emacs vs eclipse? Are there any advantages of
> emacs over eclipse?
>
> I'm a grad student and I've been using emacs for over 6 years ( it was
> the first thing I ever tried and it worked for me). Recently, I had to
> "take over" a project and improve it. I didn't have the
> design/documentation. The only thing I had was the code ( about 500
> java files, 55 packages and 112kloc) developed over 5 years (yes, it
> is a research project).
>
> Using eclipse helped me quickly understand the code. Eclipse helped me
> efficiently search/navigate between files and methods. I found the
> eclipse ide to be more powerful than the emacs-ide
> (http://jdee.sunsite.dk/).
>
> Given that eclipse has plugins for C/Java/Latex and runs on Linux/Win,
> I don't see a reason why I should stick with emacs.
>
> I would like to know why emacs-users (who have also tried eclipse) are
> still sticking with emacs ?
>
> An Eclipse Convert.

I would expect to find little substantive discussion about the merits of one
over the other. One or the other is going to fit your coding style and
organizational requirements better than the other. I say, pick the one you
like best and go forward. I just don't see much point in such a discussion.

- Virgil

On 5 Oct 2004, wrote:

> Hello everyone,
> Is there a discussion on emacs vs eclipse? Are there any advantages of
> emacs over eclipse?
>
> I'm a grad student and I've been using emacs for over 6 years ( it was
> the first thing I ever tried and it worked for me). Recently, I had to
> "take over" a project and improve it. I didn't have the
> design/documentation. The only thing I had was the code ( about 500
> java files, 55 packages and 112kloc) developed over 5 years (yes, it
> is a research project).
>
> Using eclipse helped me quickly understand the code. Eclipse helped me
> efficiently search/navigate between files and methods. I found the
> eclipse ide to be more powerful than the emacs-ide
> (http://jdee.sunsite.dk/).
>
> Given that eclipse has plugins for C/Java/Latex and runs on Linux/Win,
> I don't see a reason why I should stick with emacs.
>
> I would like to know why emacs-users (who have also tried eclipse) are
> still sticking with emacs ?

Have you ever tried Emacs with the ECB (Emacs Code browser)? See
http://ecb.sf.net Well, i admit, the underlying parsing-engine of CEDET
(http://cedet.sf.net) need some additional work to fulfill all needs but for
many cases it works already now like a charm.

ECB itself needs also some further enhancements especially for browsing big
class-hierarchies but in general ECB offers you already a lot what you need to
navigate fast and efficient through source-code and understand it.

Klaus

>
> An Eclipse Convert.

--
Klaus Berndl mailto:
sd&m AG http://www.sdm.de
software design & management
Carl-Wery-Str. 42, 81739 Muenchen, Germany
Tel +49 89 63812-392, Fax -220

"slowCoder" <> wrote in message
news: om...
> Using eclipse helped me quickly understand the code. Eclipse helped me
> efficiently search/navigate between files and methods. I found the
> eclipse ide to be more powerful than the emacs-ide
> (http://jdee.sunsite.dk/).
>
> Given that eclipse has plugins for C/Java/Latex and runs on Linux/Win,
> I don't see a reason why I should stick with emacs.
>
> I would like to know why emacs-users (who have also tried eclipse) are
> still sticking with emacs ?

Because it works the way I want it to work, and it's worked that way for the
past 10 years.

I don't use the Java IDE for emacs at all. I use syntax coloring,
auto-indent, and auto reformat. It lets me easily type my code, and not
kibitz it with every single key stroke. It lets me run ant and find my
errors quickly, it lets my mouse stay in the drawer where it belongs. I have
no problem navigating large source trees with it. It keeps the project
management out of the editor, where it belongs IMHO, letting the project
management be whatever it want's to be.

Here, we've basically standardized on Ant, and let anyone choose whichever
editor et al they wish. We have Visual Studio folks, NetBeans, Eclipse,
IDEA, old JRun Studio, and jEdit folks here, as well as me, the lone emacs
guy. I think I'm the only one who has bothered to jump through the non-hoops
to get something as simple as being able to jump to syntax errors spit out
from Ant (ant -emacs -find). I don't know what the others do, but they all
run ant from a second window.

If I want to crawl through source code, emacs can do it, or I can use the
shell. If I want wizards, I've got those in the awk scripts I've developed
over time.

I have enough of an investment in emacs that it is painful and expensive for
me to switch to something else, yet it is adaptable enough to let me work
productively in all sorts of environments, with all sorts of languages. It
also makes for a comfortable marriage withouth having to look to jump
bandwagons every 6 months as the Next NEW! IMPROVED!! Best things comes
along.

About the only thing it lacks is refactoring, but that doesn't slow me down
that much I don't think, and, heck, the jdee may even have it. I'm not
really missing it.

I'm glad that Eclipse works for you, but I've tried it, and for me, emacs is
a better fit. YMMV.

> An Eclipse Convert.

An Emacs Grognard.

Regards,

Will Hartung
()

(slowCoder) writes:

> Hello everyone,
> Is there a discussion on emacs vs eclipse? Are there any advantages of
> emacs over eclipse?
>
> I'm a grad student and I've been using emacs for over 6 years ( it was
> the first thing I ever tried and it worked for me). Recently, I had to
> "take over" a project and improve it. I didn't have the
> design/documentation. The only thing I had was the code ( about 500
> java files, 55 packages and 112kloc) developed over 5 years (yes, it
> is a research project).
>
> Using eclipse helped me quickly understand the code. Eclipse helped me
> efficiently search/navigate between files and methods. I found the
> eclipse ide to be more powerful than the emacs-ide
> (http://jdee.sunsite.dk/).
>
> Given that eclipse has plugins for C/Java/Latex and runs on Linux/Win,
> I don't see a reason why I should stick with emacs.
>
> I would like to know why emacs-users (who have also tried eclipse) are
> still sticking with emacs ?
>
> An Eclipse Convert.

Some people said that eclipse is so nice that it's going to replace
Emacs. Out of curiosity and suspect, I've tried eclipse for a while. Well,
it really drove me crazy, who has been used to Emacs. There are so many
menus, options, windows... ooh, look, How much spaces are there left for
the main edit space ? Emacs is nearly an OS, eclipse is far from it. Emacs
has elisp. Ecplise can't even run on console, can it?...... Ecplise may has
some advantages, but i would still stick with Emacs.

--
William Xuuu
Humans remove heyyy_ from the email address to reply.

slowCoder wrote:

> Is there a discussion on emacs vs eclipse? Are there any advantages of
> emacs over eclipse?

I have used Eclipse and IntelliJ/IDEA but stick to Emacs.

While the two has some nice features, especially on
refactoring, Emacs is way ahead when it comes to pure
editing control, which is what I do 95% of the time
anyway.

>>>>> "sloowcoderr" == slowCoder <> writes:

sloowcoderr> I would like to know why emacs-users (who have also
sloowcoderr> tried eclipse) are still sticking with emacs ?

Eclipse CDT editor doesn't support the Whitesmith indentation style
(which is practically mandatory for Symbian C++ development) yet. I
guess that's about it for me. Customizing the emacs indentation style
is somewhat easy, while I have absolutely no idea how to do that in
eclipse, if possible at all. Running an indentation tool
after-the-fact doesn't feel appealing.

Also, the Python plugin, pydev, isn't perfectly stable quite yet. It's
pretty good already, though, and I've been trying to have the
discipline to launch it instead of emacs to edit my python scripts.

If you are programming in Java, Eclipse is a no-brainer. For some, it
might be a reason to *choose* Java in the first place.

--
Ville Vainio http://tinyurl.com/2prnb

>>>>> "William" == William Xuuu <> writes:

William> menus, options, windows... ooh, look, How much spaces are
William> there left for the main edit space ? Emacs is nearly an
William> OS, eclipse is far from it. Emacs

ctrl+m helps there (maximizes the edit window). Eclipse actually feels
much less cluttered than the other IDEs I've tried.

William> has elisp. Ecplise can't even run on console, can
William> it?...... Ecplise may has

Running in a console is not a priority for me anymore - actually, I
tend to launch "jed" every time I want to edit something quickly in a
console.

I'm a long time emacs user. The following article was an eye-opener,
of a sort, for me:

http://pinard.progiciels-bpi.ca/opinions/editors.html

--
Ville Vainio http://tinyurl.com/2prnb

"Ville Vainio" <> wrote in message
news:...
> I'm a long time emacs user. The following article was an eye-opener,
> of a sort, for me:
>
> http://pinard.progiciels-bpi.ca/opinions/editors.html

He's abandoning emacs for a whole slew of reasons that simply do not affect
me, nor, I would say, most emacs users.

I just use the darn thing. I don't write it, maintain it, extend it, or get
involved in its politics.

Regards,

Will Hartung
()

Ville Vainio wrote:
> Eclipse CDT editor doesn't support the Whitesmith indentation style
> (which is practically mandatory for Symbian C++ development) yet. I

Of course it does.

> guess that's about it for me. Customizing the emacs indentation style
> is somewhat easy, while I have absolutely no idea how to do that in
> eclipse, if possible at all.

Then you haven't bothered to try and find out because that's a matter
of opening the help window and typing in "indentation".

And to think that it's usually emacs that's being touted as the ultimate
tool which you just have to invest a bit of time to learn... Apparently
that investment is so big and difficult to acquire that its users become
scared of even the tiniest little effort that might lead them away from it