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Hello everyone,

I've been fiddling with writing a small applet I'ld like to make
available, however, I noticed that the <applet> tag is considered
deprecated for HTML, and not allowed in XHTML (Strict). Since it's only
deprecated, I've continued to use it, but am trying to weigh the costs:

<applet> works on most current browsers and platforms, but not the most
recent versions of windows, and with possible conflicts of future
standards... maybe even ones that future plug-ins will cease to address.

<object> OTH, is supposed to be supported by modern browsers /
implementations. I like the idea of a tag that has some integrated and
consistant method of prompting the user to make a download if they don't
have the component installed. But, finding documentation on using <object>
(or perhaps just getting it to do what I want... load an applet!) seems
quite lacking.
From what I can tell, this involves hard-coding a pointer, as a string,
related to the windows registry. That alone raises a warning flag or two.
Further... this seems to reek of breaking the cross-platform nature of a
Java applet.

As far as the HTML converter went, I think it opened up my HTML file and
barfed in it. The page wouldn't load correctly in my browser (and yes, I'm
running windows), and the generated HTML was just plain too ugly to
attempt to maintain. Also, my applet runs fine with JREs as low as 1.1...
even tested with JView... why would I want to enforce requiring at least
the 1.4 Plug-in, just because that happens to be the version I'm running
HTML converter from? Why should the user have to download 15 MB for a 65
MB program to run a 6 KB applet?

Perhaps there is a way to use some javascript to select the most
appropriate tag?

Thanks for listening, and for your insight,

Frank

On Fri, 28 May 2004 01:01:56 GMT, Frank wrote:

> <applet> works on most current browsers and platforms, but not the most
> recent versions of windows, and with possible conflicts of future
> standards... maybe even ones that future plug-ins will cease to address.

You are a bit mixed up.
Stick with the <applet> tag..

> <object> OTH, is supposed to be supported by modern browsers /
> implementations. I like the idea of a tag that has some integrated and
> consistant method of prompting the user to make a download if they don't
> have the component installed.

Use the JavaVersionApplet instead..
<http://www.physci.org/codes/jre.jsp>

> As far as the HTML converter went, I think it opened up my HTML file and
> barfed in it.

I think it was designed for that,
...don't get me started.

>..The page wouldn't load correctly in my browser (and yes, I'm
> running windows), and the generated HTML was just plain too ugly to
> attempt to maintain. Also, my applet runs fine with JREs as low as 1.1...
> even tested with JView...

Wow! You are keen!

The applet tag will do you just fine if
your applet *runs* in 1.1. The only thing
you need to add is a sensible 'alt' tag and
the 'no java' alternative to link to either
the Sun download page, or a message..

> Perhaps there is a way to use some javascript to select the most
> appropriate tag?

Not necessary, use the applet above..

--
Andrew Thompson
http://www.PhySci.org/ Open-source software suite
http://www.PhySci.org/codes/ Web & IT Help
http://www.1point1C.org/ Science & Technology

On Fri, 28 May 2004 01:01:56 GMT, Frank <> wrote or
quoted :

>I've been fiddling with writing a small applet I'ld like to make
>available, however, I noticed that the <applet> tag is considered
>deprecated for HTML, and not allowed in XHTML (Strict). Since it's only
>deprecated, I've continued to use it, but am trying to weigh the costs:

I say screw-em. The replacements are preposterous in the extreme.
Applet works nearly everywhere. Refuse to go along with the embed
bullshit.

--
Canadian Mind Products, Roedy Green.
Coaching, problem solving, economical contract programming.
See http://mindprod.com/jgloss/jgloss.html for The Java Glossary.

Thanks for the response! I think I'll be content then to continue with the
<applet> as you suggested, and just throw in a link to www.java.com in the
midst of the tag. The JavaVersionApplet is certainly interesting, but I'm
not so worried about 1.0 folks as I am of people not having a VM installed
at all :/

Thanks for you advice!

Frank

On Fri, 28 May 2004 01:20:33 GMT, Andrew Thompson <>
wrote:

> On Fri, 28 May 2004 01:01:56 GMT, Frank wrote:
>
>> <applet> works on most current browsers and platforms, but not the most
>> recent versions of windows, and with possible conflicts of future
>> standards... maybe even ones that future plug-ins will cease to address.
>
> You are a bit mixed up.
> Stick with the <applet> tag..
>
>> <object> OTH, is supposed to be supported by modern browsers /
>> implementations. I like the idea of a tag that has some integrated and
>> consistant method of prompting the user to make a download if they don't
>> have the component installed.
>
> Use the JavaVersionApplet instead..
> <http://www.physci.org/codes/jre.jsp>
>
>> As far as the HTML converter went, I think it opened up my HTML file and
>> barfed in it.
>
> I think it was designed for that,
> ..don't get me started.
>
>> ..The page wouldn't load correctly in my browser (and yes, I'm
>> running windows), and the generated HTML was just plain too ugly to
>> attempt to maintain. Also, my applet runs fine with JREs as low as
>> 1.1...
>> even tested with JView...
>
> Wow! You are keen!
>
> The applet tag will do you just fine if
> your applet *runs* in 1.1. The only thing
> you need to add is a sensible 'alt' tag and
> the 'no java' alternative to link to either
> the Sun download page, or a message..
>
>> Perhaps there is a way to use some javascript to select the most
>> appropriate tag?
>
> Not necessary, use the applet above..
>

On Fri, 28 May 2004 02:17:47 GMT, Roedy Green
<look-> wrote:

> On Fri, 28 May 2004 01:01:56 GMT, Frank <> wrote or
> quoted :
>
>> I've been fiddling with writing a small applet I'ld like to make
>> available, however, I noticed that the <applet> tag is considered
>> deprecated for HTML, and not allowed in XHTML (Strict). Since it's only
>> deprecated, I've continued to use it, but am trying to weigh the costs:
>
> I say screw-em. The replacements are preposterous in the extreme.
> Applet works nearly everywhere. Refuse to go along with the embed
> bullshit.
>

Thanks for the response Roedy; I think I'll be sticking with <applet>. I'm
glad I'm not the only one that isn't fond of the <object> specifications!

On Fri, 28 May 2004 05:01:34 GMT, Frank wrote:

> Thanks for the response! I think I'll be content then to continue with the
> <applet> as you suggested, and just throw in a link to www.java.com in the
> midst of the tag. The JavaVersionApplet is certainly interesting, but I'm
> not so worried about 1.0 folks as I am of people not having a VM installed
> at all :/

Oh no.. I would not use it for a 1.1 applet.
I have never actually heard of a Java 1.0
installed in a browser. I developed it
for Swing applets mostly, for which it is
quite useful.

A note on using the <applet> tag.

You can still get your HTML to validate, _and_
use stylesheets so long as you declare the content
to be 4.01Transitional - that way it validates with
anything from HTML 3.2 or 4.01.

I reckon, with me, Roedy, and now you..
We can get the W3C/Sun to change their minds
about the <applet> tag, and undeprecate it..



--
Andrew Thompson
http://www.PhySci.org/ Open-source software suite
http://www.PhySci.org/codes/ Web & IT Help
http://www.1point1C.org/ Science & Technology

This website will explain how to transfer from HTML using the applet
tag to XHTML using the object tag

http://ww2.cs.fsu.edu/~steele/XHTML/appletObject.html
--
Shayne Steele Graduate Student in Computer Science at FSU
Home Page: http://ww2.cs.fsu.edu/~steele/
They that can give up essential liberty to obtain a little temporary
safety deserve neither liberty nor safety. - Benjamin Franklin