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thingy 04-07-2006 10:08 PM

Sometimes I wonder......maybe I just need a better job......
 
Business analyst, Project Manager and Solutions Architect all get
together.....

PM, Ok we have 5 weeks to do this in.....Core need is to distribute info
over the web to users.

SA, Ok in this time frame we need to find a ready made solution, we dont
have time to write our own........has either of you found any ready made
packages? have you asked any others if they have something we can buy
off them?

BA....yes, only one, its Perl & Unix though.....cough splutter no thanks....

PM, Well we wont go near that stuff.....

SA, Well we could at least look as its code......

PM, No, we wont go near that stuff......

SA, So how many users will it support, is it mission critical?

BA & PM, we dont know we have not looked at that yet.....yes its mission
critical.

So anyway here's me thinking, they have not scoped the job, know
virtually nothing, but have already discounted a possible solution even
though it might be ready made for them.....but they have decided its
mission critical...OK...

SA, BA & PM trundle over to see Solution Engineer....OK. we have no
money, no hardware and little time, do you have 2 ~ 4 servers lying
around we can use?

SE, Yes I have 2 U1 Xeon boxes that are lightly loaded and a massive
Xeon MP box that are very lightly loaded....they have special 24/7 1
hour fast response contracts for hware and software.....so there is your
2 web front ends and dbase backend......it already has authentication...

SA, BA, & PM, oh great when can we have them to rebuild for this
project.....

SE, you cant they run 3 small but mission critical applications.....

BA & PM, thats OK we can shove all those onto one box and free up 2
boxes....

SE, I said mission critical...20 minute response....type stuff.

SA, uh wait one, what are those applications?

SE, Master DNS, slave DNS, Primary SMTP servers in active/active
cluster, primary openLDAP authentication server...

BA & PM, oh so why cant we have all those on one box?

SA, looks at them with raised eyebrows.....remember the mission critical
bit?

SA, so these are Linux obviously?

SE, Yes.....

BA & PM, Ok well never mind then we'll look elsewhere......


Arrgg....Ho hum.......sometimes.......

:(

regards

Thing











-=rjh=- 04-07-2006 10:12 PM

Re: Sometimes I wonder......maybe I just need a better job......
 
thingy wrote:
> Business analyst, Project Manager and Solutions Architect all get
> together.....
>
> PM, Ok we have 5 weeks to do this in.....Core need is to distribute info
> over the web to users.
>
> SA, Ok in this time frame we need to find a ready made solution, we dont
> have time to write our own........has either of you found any ready made
> packages? have you asked any others if they have something we can buy
> off them?
>
> BA....yes, only one, its Perl & Unix though.....cough splutter no
> thanks....
>
> PM, Well we wont go near that stuff.....
>
> SA, Well we could at least look as its code......
>
> PM, No, we wont go near that stuff......
>
> SA, So how many users will it support, is it mission critical?
>
> BA & PM, we dont know we have not looked at that yet.....yes its mission
> critical.
>
> So anyway here's me thinking, they have not scoped the job, know
> virtually nothing, but have already discounted a possible solution even
> though it might be ready made for them.....but they have decided its
> mission critical...OK...
>
> SA, BA & PM trundle over to see Solution Engineer....OK. we have no
> money, no hardware and little time, do you have 2 ~ 4 servers lying
> around we can use?
>
> SE, Yes I have 2 U1 Xeon boxes that are lightly loaded and a massive
> Xeon MP box that are very lightly loaded....they have special 24/7 1
> hour fast response contracts for hware and software.....so there is your
> 2 web front ends and dbase backend......it already has authentication...
>
> SA, BA, & PM, oh great when can we have them to rebuild for this
> project.....
>
> SE, you cant they run 3 small but mission critical applications.....
>
> BA & PM, thats OK we can shove all those onto one box and free up 2
> boxes....
>
> SE, I said mission critical...20 minute response....type stuff.
>
> SA, uh wait one, what are those applications?
>
> SE, Master DNS, slave DNS, Primary SMTP servers in active/active
> cluster, primary openLDAP authentication server...
>
> BA & PM, oh so why cant we have all those on one box?
>
> SA, looks at them with raised eyebrows.....remember the mission critical
> bit?
>
> SA, so these are Linux obviously?
>
> SE, Yes.....
>
> BA & PM, Ok well never mind then we'll look elsewhere......
>
>
> Arrgg....Ho hum.......sometimes.......
>
> :(
>


Excellent!

Could almost be a scene from the BOFH :-)

Mauricio Freitas [MVP] 04-07-2006 10:16 PM

Re: Sometimes I wonder......maybe I just need a better job......
 
"thingy" <thingy@nowhere.commy> wrote in message
news:4436e196$1@clear.net.nz...
> Business analyst, Project Manager and Solutions Architect all get
> together.....
>


Sorry, but when I read PM and SA together... That told the whole story
already.

It's bad, it's really bad - people have no skills to treat other people, and
even less skills to understand simple technical stuff.

I don't think people in these (PM) roles should have high technical skills -
but a little bit, to understand the complexities would be good.

I've heard so amny of these conversations before, it's not funny. All they
think of is "delivery, delivery", at the cost of anything else, even if it's
moving an established solution out of the way to satisfy the "less time,
less people, less cost" paradigm they live on...


--

Mauricio Freitas
www.geekzone.co.nz, www.geekzone.co.nz/freitasm,
www.geekzone.co.nz/geekzoneblog.asp
Software for Pocket PC: www.geekzone.co.nz/store
Microsoft MVP Mobile Devices



Peter Huebner 04-07-2006 11:23 PM

Re: Sometimes I wonder......maybe I just need a better job......
 
In article <4436e196$1@clear.net.nz>, thingy@nowhere.commy says...
>
> Business analyst, Project Manager and Solutions Architect all get
> together.....
>


Just be glad there wasn't an Anderoid involved!
(I used to lurk on alt.sysadmin.recovery for kicks)

<wink> -Peter

--
=========================================
firstname dot lastname at gmail fullstop com

thingy 04-07-2006 11:25 PM

Re: Sometimes I wonder......maybe I just need a better job......
 
-=rjh=- wrote:
> thingy wrote:
>
>> Business analyst, Project Manager and Solutions Architect all get
>> together.....
>>
>> PM, Ok we have 5 weeks to do this in.....Core need is to distribute
>> info over the web to users.
>>
>> SA, Ok in this time frame we need to find a ready made solution, we
>> dont have time to write our own........has either of you found any
>> ready made packages? have you asked any others if they have something
>> we can buy off them?
>>
>> BA....yes, only one, its Perl & Unix though.....cough splutter no
>> thanks....
>>
>> PM, Well we wont go near that stuff.....
>>
>> SA, Well we could at least look as its code......
>>
>> PM, No, we wont go near that stuff......
>>
>> SA, So how many users will it support, is it mission critical?
>>
>> BA & PM, we dont know we have not looked at that yet.....yes its
>> mission critical.
>>
>> So anyway here's me thinking, they have not scoped the job, know
>> virtually nothing, but have already discounted a possible solution
>> even though it might be ready made for them.....but they have decided
>> its mission critical...OK...
>>
>> SA, BA & PM trundle over to see Solution Engineer....OK. we have no
>> money, no hardware and little time, do you have 2 ~ 4 servers lying
>> around we can use?
>>
>> SE, Yes I have 2 U1 Xeon boxes that are lightly loaded and a massive
>> Xeon MP box that are very lightly loaded....they have special 24/7 1
>> hour fast response contracts for hware and software.....so there is
>> your 2 web front ends and dbase backend......it already has
>> authentication...
>>
>> SA, BA, & PM, oh great when can we have them to rebuild for this
>> project.....
>>
>> SE, you cant they run 3 small but mission critical applications.....
>>
>> BA & PM, thats OK we can shove all those onto one box and free up 2
>> boxes....
>>
>> SE, I said mission critical...20 minute response....type stuff.
>>
>> SA, uh wait one, what are those applications?
>>
>> SE, Master DNS, slave DNS, Primary SMTP servers in active/active
>> cluster, primary openLDAP authentication server...
>>
>> BA & PM, oh so why cant we have all those on one box?
>>
>> SA, looks at them with raised eyebrows.....remember the mission
>> critical bit?
>>
>> SA, so these are Linux obviously?
>>
>> SE, Yes.....
>>
>> BA & PM, Ok well never mind then we'll look elsewhere......
>>
>>
>> Arrgg....Ho hum.......sometimes.......
>>
>> :(
>>

>
> Excellent!
>
> Could almost be a scene from the BOFH :-)


heh.....yes, sort of I felt gutted myself, have tried hard for 2 years
to grow the Unix/Linux capability and have now have capacity yet little
work.....

BA's and PM's complaining about lack of resource.....on the Unix side we
have an automated build system, it can build 5 servers at once, all in
about 1 hour, Qa'd to boot....takes the NT team 3 days to do one......so
we could build circa 20 servers a day.....with one person....it also
means we have a bare metal DR in that time frame.....none on the NT side...

I have 2 Unix/Linux SE's both are probably not 50% utilised....should
have 5~6 NT SE's....have 2 vacancies........and another resigned this
week...all three were 100%+ so now its two....

:/

job hunt time me thinks.....before I do a BOFH and mains wire some door
knobs....

;]

regards

Thing





rupert 04-07-2006 11:28 PM

Re: Sometimes I wonder......maybe I just need a better job......
 
Of course the solution has been sold before the BA has worked with the
customer to determine user numbers, how mission critical the solution is,
what the exact requirements of the customer are so as to develop a
functional requirement document which is used for the statement of work,
technical design and quote etc etc


>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>




Have A Nice Cup of Tea 04-07-2006 11:32 PM

Re: Sometimes I wonder......maybe I just need a better job......
 
On Sat, 08 Apr 2006 10:08:09 +1200, thingy wrote:

> SA, so these are Linux obviously?
>
> SE, Yes.....
>
> BA & PM, Ok well never mind then we'll look elsewhere.


That is just so
can't-use-wont-use-anything-other-than-Micro$oft-even-tho'-there-is-a-perfect-solution-sitting-there-ready-to-use!


Have A Nice Cup of Tea

--
Martin Taylor, GM of platform strategy at Microsoft: "We found
that the Linux environment provided about 15 percent more end
user loss of productivity." - *provided MORE loss of productivity*


thingy 04-07-2006 11:35 PM

Re: Sometimes I wonder......maybe I just need a better job......
 
Mauricio Freitas [MVP] wrote:
> "thingy" <thingy@nowhere.commy> wrote in message
> news:4436e196$1@clear.net.nz...
>
>>Business analyst, Project Manager and Solutions Architect all get
>>together.....
>>

>
>
> Sorry, but when I read PM and SA together... That told the whole story
> already.


The SA is actually good, bit MS biased but not to the extent that it
bothers me....given the time frames the SA is often under going with
something the SA knows will do it has some justification.....

> It's bad, it's really bad - people have no skills to treat other people, and
> even less skills to understand simple technical stuff.


PM and BA dont need to understand tech stuff, but the business need,
scope and time frame...yet make offhand tech decisions before even
having a scope.

> I don't think people in these (PM) roles should have high technical skills -
> but a little bit, to understand the complexities would be good.


See above....

> I've heard so amny of these conversations before, it's not funny.


Up until today I suspected them, now they were open to my face....

> All they
> think of is "delivery, delivery", at the cost of anything else, even if it's
> moving an established solution out of the way to satisfy the "less time,
> less people, less cost" paradigm they live on...


This is where I like OSS over CSS, with OSS there is no PM, so "us
techies" can take the time to make the solution work well........with no
real time frame. No good ofr business maybe? if so why do businesses
want it? my biggest fear is that the business needs start to drive
things and OS loses the edge people went to it for in the first place.

Considering I had the Linux hardware and capability to do it and
probably in the time frame....ssshhhh bugger it......why bother....

regards

Thing







thingy 04-07-2006 11:38 PM

Re: Sometimes I wonder......maybe I just need a better job......
 
rupert wrote:
> Of course the solution has been sold before the BA has worked with the
> customer to determine user numbers, how mission critical the solution is,
> what the exact requirements of the customer are so as to develop a
> functional requirement document which is used for the statement of work,
> technical design and quote etc etc


In this case they dont have a solution.....but yes funnily enough that
was the outcome of the last project.....

regards

Thing

thingy 04-07-2006 11:40 PM

Re: Sometimes I wonder......maybe I just need a better job......
 
Have A Nice Cup of Tea wrote:
> On Sat, 08 Apr 2006 10:08:09 +1200, thingy wrote:
>
>
>>SA, so these are Linux obviously?
>>
>>SE, Yes.....
>>
>>BA & PM, Ok well never mind then we'll look elsewhere.

>
>
> That is just so
> can't-use-wont-use-anything-other-than-Micro$oft-even-tho'-there-is-a-perfect-solution-sitting-there-ready-to-use!
>
>
> Have A Nice Cup of Tea
>


Yes, dont think I have felt so f*cked off in two+ years....

:/

regards

Thing


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