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-   -   Re: XML (fwd) (http://www.velocityreviews.com/forums/t318935-re-xml-fwd.html)

Lulu of the Lotus-Eaters 06-27-2003 04:31 PM

Re: XML (fwd)
 
mwilson@the-wire.com (Mel Wilson) wrote previously:
| And there isn't much to XML. There's a first line of
|version information... Then there's
|the XML object, of the form
| <bracket metadata> contents </bracket>
|Add a shortcut <bracket metatdata />

Add entity escaping
Add namespace declarations
Add namespace modified tags
Add namespace modified attributes
Add CDATA sections
Add Processing Instructions
Add Character entities
Add Numeric entities
Add DTD declarations
Add infoset modification
Add validation against DTDs
Add comments
Add whitespace normalization
Add specification of ignorable and non-ignorable whitespace

.... and then you're almost there.

What could be easier?

--
Keeping medicines from the bloodstreams of the sick; food from the bellies
of the hungry; books from the hands of the uneducated; technology from the
underdeveloped; and putting advocates of freedom in prisons. Intellectual
property is to the 21st century what the slave trade was to the 16th.


David Mertz 06-28-2003 05:45 PM

Re: XML
 
mwilson@the-wire.com (Mel Wilson) wrote previously:
|>| And there isn't much to XML. There's a first line of
|>|version information... Then there's
|[ ... ]
|>Add entity escaping
|>Add namespace declarations
|>Add namespace modified tags
|>Add namespace modified attributes
|[ ... ]

I do think a lot of people miss the difference in infoset augmentation
during validating and non-validating parsing. Since DTDs are part of
the XML spec, you simply cannot ignore this (except by subsetting actual
XML). I give an example at:

http://www-106.ibm.com/developerwork...matters26.html

Btw. The linked article discusses RELAX NG's parsimony here. Even
though James Clark emailed me and objected to my characterization of
RELAX NG as still augmenting just-a-little-bit, I stand by that remark.

Entities in DTDs (including internal subsets; were those in the addendum
list?) are similar in this general way.

Yours, David...

P.S. The moral I actually take from the thread is that it is possible to
take a small subset of actual XML, and call that simple (because it is).
But it is a massive mental effort to understand every weird corner case
in the XML spec.

--
Keeping medicines from the bloodstreams of the sick; food from the bellies
of the hungry; books from the hands of the uneducated; technology from the
underdeveloped; and putting advocates of freedom in prisons. Intellectual
property is to the 21st century what the slave trade was to the 16th.


Fredrik Lundh 06-28-2003 08:00 PM

Re: XML
 
David Mertz wrote:

> P.S. The moral I actually take from the thread is that it is possible to
> take a small subset of actual XML, and call that simple (because it is).
> But it is a massive mental effort to understand every weird corner case
> in the XML spec.


yup, that's why I've just set up a Wiki with the goal of creating a new,
better standard. it's time to wrestle control over XML away from the
current owners, and create something that people can actually use and
that can rally the XML community around a common cause.

oops. wrong forum.

sorry /F





Fredrik Lundh 06-28-2003 08:05 PM

Re: XML (fwd)
 
Mel Wilson wrote:

> >Add entity escaping
> >Add namespace declarations
> >Add namespace modified tags
> >Add namespace modified attributes

> [ ... ]
> >... and then you're almost there.
> >
> >What could be easier?

>
> Thanks. I'm making a study list for my next run through
> _XML in a Nutshell_. DTD validation I know and handwaved
> away, the rest is on. Namespaces particularly. The people
> I was seeing coming to Usenet to be peeved at XML were
> dwelling on the issues I did cover. xml.sax seems to
> have handled a lot without bothering me.


As any reasonable XML library does, of course: when processing XML,
you don't really need to care about more than elements, attributes,
and character content. (IIRC, Sean McGrath used to talk about the
four piggies; start tags, end tags, attributes, and data)

And when producing XML, you can pick whatever subset you feel
confident using. (usually the four piggies plus character entities).

</F>






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